Check out the patch notes for the v17 Precursor Update here: http://maplestory2.nexon.net/en/news/article/53778/precursor-update-v17

I was wrong about what MS2 is supposed to be

mirta000mirta000
MapleStory 2 Rep: 8,275
Posts: 512
Member
edited 1:17AM May 10, 2019 in General Chat
I was wrong in my thinking about what Maplestory 2 is supposed to be and I finally fully deleted it off my computer and it's alright.

Beta gave me the impression that this was going to be a cute social casual MMO. We did mini games, we did lots of house building, I loved the create an outfit feature, I've played mushking royale for a month, I've bought the biggest possible pre-release pack and gifted a few of the other ones to my guild. I highly highly regret doing this now, but I guess serves me right for judging a game from the beta.

I suppose I could have just jumped through loops to play the Asian versions to understand what the game is going to be like, however the Western team was insisting that they can make changes and I believed them.

Maplestory 2, in its core, is the same game that for example Blade and Soul, or Black Desert Online is. It is all about grinding for gear until RNG jesus smiles on you, in order to progress to new content and grind for gear again.

I think, as a raiding MMO and as a grinder, MS2 fails, as there are already other games in the genre that fill that niche. Want good, structured raiding? Go to WoW or FFXIV. Even with the botched WoW's gear up system, you'll have an easier time, plus every time there's a level increase, the game is essentially reset to an even playing field.

My go-to grinder is Black Desert Online if I desire that. I don't desire that often, but it's rather relaxing if you just want to kill heaps and heaps of enemies in real world and I would say far more rewarding. Their crafting is also more involved and there's plenty of side skills and activities to engage in if you don't want to just fight. BDO is pay to win, but so is Maplestory 2 now considering that they're now letting you buy money off developers and paying for dungeon carries seems to not be discouraged as far as new players go.

I really really would have rather Maplestory 2 did not focus on its raids and dungeons. Those should be accessible to all in very low gear-score demands. It should have focused on releasing new and rewarding mini games, more furniture and building materials, more emotes, more derpy events and achievements, they could have done with improving their crafting, gathering and any other side activity, for social MMOs are few and far in between.

However plenty will disagree with me I guess. And it's ok. The game does not have to cater to me, I simply made the mistake thinking that it did. So it's time for me to now finally stop checking back entirely. Adios.

TLDR: Beta gave me the impression that MS2 was a casual social MMO. It is not. It is much closer to other raiding and grinding MMOs, but worse. I wish I hadn't made that mistake and spent obscene amount of money on it on release, but it's ok. I will not repeat my mistake with future releases, so lesson learned there and the game does not have to cater to me.

EDIT: inbefore someone will tell me that the game is all about what you make it out to be and that it does provide social activities - development does not focus on social activities. It rather funnels everyone into the main activity of the game, which is raiding, which sets a completely different atmosphere and expectations from other players. I am sure that there are still some nice little casual guilds out there, but due to general attitude from the players, due to what the game is now widely perceived to be, I would have an easier time to find this social side of the game in other games.
ArSkulderHersikBakaAnikiMiahooUllDefraglifeAgent_DragonfurySylqtNorthboundHenryethaand 5 others.

Comments

  • IllIIlIllIIl
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 3,165
    Posts: 479
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    mirta000 wrote: »
    however the Western team was insisting that they can make changes and I believed them.

    Well they "can" and in most cases they did, problem is that these changes (like adding Fair Fight to the Rumbles) were mostly done to cater to the "hartcore" part of the player base which is a stupid thing to do for a game they advertise as "casual / social MMORPG".


    mirta000 wrote: »
    I really really would have rather Maplestory 2 did not focus on its raids and dungeons.

    Their focus on dungeons by itself isn't really the problem, normal dungeons for example are perfectly fine because they are designed to be soloable and just scale up if you bring more players along. The problem starts with hard dungeons were you "need" to fulfill certain requirements in order to not get kicked, this is where they lose many players which can't stand this kind of environment which is even worse when it comes to raids.

    But yeah, progression shouldn't be limited to just a few parts of the game. We have crafting wich essentially amounts to nothing. WBs don't drop anything of value either while in other MMOs they do. They need to completely overhaul their approach to character progression (and frankly gear design as well).
    Agent_Dragonfury
  • WillowleafWillowleaf
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 340
    Posts: 4
    Member
    Hardcore players are nothing but a tiny, minuscule, barely existing group, that is as well the most vocal and the winiest. Oh yes! They're such crybabies! It's a major waste of money for devs to listen to them for 1 seconde, and hardcore players have ruined so many games and MMOORPGs.
    Agent_DragonfuryHenryethaAnOldGeezer
  • GarlicBreadGarlicBread
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 3,035
    Posts: 273
    Member
    mirta000 wrote: »
    I was wrong in my thinking about what Maplestory 2 is supposed to be and I finally fully deleted it off my computer and it's alright.

    Beta gave me the impression that this was going to be a cute social casual MMO. We did mini games, we did lots of house building, I loved the create an outfit feature, I've played mushking royale for a month, I've bought the biggest possible pre-release pack and gifted a few of the other ones to my guild. I highly highly regret doing this now, but I guess serves me right for judging a game from the beta.

    I suppose I could have just jumped through loops to play the Asian versions to understand what the game is going to be like, however the Western team was insisting that they can make changes and I believed them.

    Maplestory 2, in its core, is the same game that for example Blade and Soul, or Black Desert Online is. It is all about grinding for gear until RNG jesus smiles on you, in order to progress to new content and grind for gear again.

    I think, as a raiding MMO and as a grinder, MS2 fails, as there are already other games in the genre that fill that niche. Want good, structured raiding? Go to WoW or FFXIV. Even with the botched WoW's gear up system, you'll have an easier time, plus every time there's a level increase, the game is essentially reset to an even playing field.

    My go-to grinder is Black Desert Online if I desire that. I don't desire that often, but it's rather relaxing if you just want to kill heaps and heaps of enemies in real world and I would say far more rewarding. Their crafting is also more involved and there's plenty of side skills and activities to engage in if you don't want to just fight. BDO is pay to win, but so is Maplestory 2 now considering that they're now letting you buy money off developers and paying for dungeon carries seems to not be discouraged as far as new players go.

    I really really would have rather Maplestory 2 did not focus on its raids and dungeons. Those should be accessible to all in very low gear-score demands. It should have focused on releasing new and rewarding mini games, more furniture and building materials, more emotes, more derpy events and achievements, they could have done with improving their crafting, gathering and any other side activity, for social MMOs are few and far in between.

    However plenty will disagree with me I guess. And it's ok. The game does not have to cater to me, I simply made the mistake thinking that it did. So it's time for me to now finally stop checking back entirely. Adios.

    TLDR: Beta gave me the impression that MS2 was a casual social MMO. It is not. It is much closer to other raiding and grinding MMOs, but worse. I wish I hadn't made that mistake and spent obscene amount of money on it on release, but it's ok. I will not repeat my mistake with future releases, so lesson learned there and the game does not have to cater to me.

    EDIT: inbefore someone will tell me that the game is all about what you make it out to be and that it does provide social activities - development does not focus on social activities. It rather funnels everyone into the main activity of the game, which is raiding, which sets a completely different atmosphere and expectations from other players. I am sure that there are still some nice little casual guilds out there, but due to general attitude from the players, due to what the game is now widely perceived to be, I would have an easier time to find this social side of the game in other games.

    I think the kind of games you are looking for is imvu,2nd life,club penguin,hobo hotel etc
    Anura_
  • NovuhzNovuhz
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 1,430
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    Member
    edited 10:39AM May 10, 2019
    Willowleaf wrote: »
    Hardcore players are nothing but a tiny, minuscule, barely existing group, that is as well the most vocal and the winiest. Oh yes! They're such crybabies! It's a major waste of money for devs to listen to them for 1 seconde, and hardcore players have ruined so many games and MMOORPGs.

    But this game is not hardcore? and these last updates made it even easier for everyone.

    Funny that you said hardcore players have ruined so many games and mmorpg's, do you know what is killing World of Warcraft currently? it's the casual players, devs started catering to casuals in WoW and now look at the state of that game.

    to the OP

    This game was always gonna be about dungeons/raids/grind for endgame from the start but I guess you didn't see how it was in KMS2 etc... but outside endgame i'd say it's pretty casual/social.

    Perhaps games like Minecraft, Trove, Cubic Castles, Creativerse, SkySaga, etc are more suited for you. Also check out Hytale I can't wait for that game to come out ^^
  • ÄrtÄrt
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 1,380
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    Member
    edited 11:12AM May 10, 2019
    Willowleaf wrote: »
    Hardcore players are nothing but a tiny, minuscule, barely existing group, that is as well the most vocal and the winiest. Oh yes! They're such crybabies! It's a major waste of money for devs to listen to them for 1 seconde, and hardcore players have ruined so many games and MMOORPGs.

    What ruins MMO's are crybabies who expect everything to be given to them for free. Who spend more time complaining how hard it is to them then actually playing. Real players play the game, instead of being jealous and trying to ruin it.
    HaliNovuhz
  • HaliHali
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 1,875
    Posts: 79
    Member
    This is a cute casual social mmo though and you can still do all that dumb house stuff atm as much as you want. With gear scores reaching as high as 15k I say 2100 for hard dungeons is plenty low enough to reach for people that know of a game beyond Tria / Queenstown.
  • OlujiwanOlujiwan
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 7,450
    Posts: 541
    Forum Moderator
    It's always sad to hear that player expectations were not met. Whether or not said expectations were realistic, doesn't even really matter.

    I think your specific issue lies within your perception of what the game needs to be and how it should stay interesting/rewarding. That's a very fair point, but also one that is extremely hard to achieve for modern MMO's because the consumers have changed immensely.

    With that being said; not everything is for everyone. Embracing that concept will vastly improve your experience across the board.

    Sidenote: Let's make sure this thread stays civilized. Remember that Maplers, if so inclined, respectfully disagree.
    Henryetha
  • BulbasaurBulbasaur
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 2,525
    Posts: 233
    Member
    edited 9:39PM May 10, 2019
    mirta000 wrote: »
    I was wrong in my thinking about what Maplestory 2 is supposed to be and I finally fully deleted it off my computer and it's alright.

    Beta gave me the impression that this was going to be a cute social casual MMO. We did mini games, we did lots of house building, I loved the create an outfit feature, I've played mushking royale for a month, I've bought the biggest possible pre-release pack and gifted a few of the other ones to my guild. I highly highly regret doing this now, but I guess serves me right for judging a game from the beta.

    I suppose I could have just jumped through loops to play the Asian versions to understand what the game is going to be like, however the Western team was insisting that they can make changes and I believed them.

    Maplestory 2, in its core, is the same game that for example Blade and Soul, or Black Desert Online is. It is all about grinding for gear until RNG jesus smiles on you, in order to progress to new content and grind for gear again.

    I think, as a raiding MMO and as a grinder, MS2 fails, as there are already other games in the genre that fill that niche. Want good, structured raiding? Go to WoW or FFXIV. Even with the botched WoW's gear up system, you'll have an easier time, plus every time there's a level increase, the game is essentially reset to an even playing field.

    My go-to grinder is Black Desert Online if I desire that. I don't desire that often, but it's rather relaxing if you just want to kill heaps and heaps of enemies in real world and I would say far more rewarding. Their crafting is also more involved and there's plenty of side skills and activities to engage in if you don't want to just fight. BDO is pay to win, but so is Maplestory 2 now considering that they're now letting you buy money off developers and paying for dungeon carries seems to not be discouraged as far as new players go.

    I really really would have rather Maplestory 2 did not focus on its raids and dungeons. Those should be accessible to all in very low gear-score demands. It should have focused on releasing new and rewarding mini games, more furniture and building materials, more emotes, more derpy events and achievements, they could have done with improving their crafting, gathering and any other side activity, for social MMOs are few and far in between.

    However plenty will disagree with me I guess. And it's ok. The game does not have to cater to me, I simply made the mistake thinking that it did. So it's time for me to now finally stop checking back entirely. Adios.

    TLDR: Beta gave me the impression that MS2 was a casual social MMO. It is not. It is much closer to other raiding and grinding MMOs, but worse. I wish I hadn't made that mistake and spent obscene amount of money on it on release, but it's ok. I will not repeat my mistake with future releases, so lesson learned there and the game does not have to cater to me.

    EDIT: inbefore someone will tell me that the game is all about what you make it out to be and that it does provide social activities - development does not focus on social activities. It rather funnels everyone into the main activity of the game, which is raiding, which sets a completely different atmosphere and expectations from other players. I am sure that there are still some nice little casual guilds out there, but due to general attitude from the players, due to what the game is now widely perceived to be, I would have an easier time to find this social side of the game in other games.

    Thing is these "social" aspects were likely never going to maintain a large playerbase. You spend 2 weeks building a house... and then what? Some players may keep creating new, original designs, however the vast majority wouldn't bother. I agree social activities should be an integral part, but it should only be a compliment.

    Problem is the combat isn't even good; I'd give it a 3/10 at best. The combat is lackluster and monotonous for many reasons including:
    - No stat progression
    - No stat diversity
    - No diversity in skill function
    - Heavy emphasis on damage
    - Rote memorization of "mechanics" rather than actual thinking
    - Repetitive gameplay (dungeons/raids) that amounts to no grand purpose
    In addition, there are also many other factors that likely result in many players quitting.
    bolder_taste
  • HersikHersik
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 570
    Posts: 13
    Member
    edited 9:04AM May 11, 2019
    Olujiwan wrote: »
    That's a very fair point, but also one that is extremely hard to achieve for modern MMO's because the consumers have changed immensely.

    I don't know how much modern MMO's requiments for current players changed but i highly doubt that it's:
    1) focus on players which likes only "first sight" graphic when you see gameplay demo
    2) endless boring griding
    3) extreme fast lvl progresion just by doing main quests
    4) repetitive side quest which haven't weight to character progresion
    5) world without live which looks more like decoration rather have some effect
    6) locked areas for players due to quests (even story quest can have teams - some enemies can't be defeated just by one entity...)
    7) F2P models which in short time change on P2W because they wanted rush development due to increased numbers of MMO's which have similar features and die after short time anyway...
    Just some high points which i discovered lately in all MMO's from modern era...

    I don't say that MS2 have all things which i highlighted above or something like that, it just what i see in current news MMO's or even upcoming ones.. And these problems have clear culprit - Asia part of online playerbase which are used to on these things and attracts them but these things have never showed some big success in West part of playerbase... Old Asia/Korean MMO's hadn't these problems at start and were on lvl where i could feel my invested time and enjoyed to play and invest more time to it... - for example: Lineage 2.. (ofc that time i was younger..)

    Last mmo which i enjoyed for longer time was early version of TERA which brough nice unique combat system, not too fast lvl progresion, nice design in side content but because it was released as F2P, the end content was unfinished... After that, era of "Modern MMO's" showed nothing interesting.. more like all tried made own view of MMO something similar to TERA and add some features from other successfull long runned MMO's. (Which is also why i feel disappointment from new upcoming mmo from same devs..)

    Maybe ESO would bring me some enjoy to these days but as fan of Elder scroll rpg i've never used on their combat system or skills system... Played even G2W before f2p but ending content just never got me though it's one of few current amazing MMO's

    To Sum up it - I would like rather buy a good mmo like rpg which gives me enjoy and impulse to go back to play it, even if developed was pretty long or even had some cash shop which would be cosmetic ones or have small progression things like bigger bags, than try figure out if new released f2p mmo has something which would be worth of investing time to it..

    I would glad if somebody here would sum up what it's this Modern Era of MMO's becuase i see only same and same mmo which except story doesn't offer something new, unique or decent speed of progression at least which doesn't belong only to end repetitive content... (not mention that some new upcoming try success on old locked/tab combat system which due to new RPG's/Updated engines/ attracts less and less players..
    MiahooAgent_Dragonfury
  • MiahooMiahoo
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 655
    Posts: 24
    Member
    Olujiwan wrote: »
    It's always sad to hear that player expectations were not met. Whether or not said expectations were realistic, doesn't even really matter.

    I think your specific issue lies within your perception of what the game needs to be and how it should stay interesting/rewarding. That's a very fair point, but also one that is extremely hard to achieve for modern MMO's because the consumers have changed immensely.

    With that being said; not everything is for everyone. Embracing that concept will vastly improve your experience across the board.

    Sidenote: Let's make sure this thread stays civilized. Remember that Maplers, if so inclined, respectfully disagree.

    That's exactly the OP point... ms2 could be much more. it could have more aspects than gear and battle alone.

    I also saw ms2 like the OP did (well, with more battle focus elements) but I'm very disappointed nothing is developed and added to the community side of the game.
    - no new designs
    - no new house options
    - no new minigames
    - no new arcades
    - no new communications options
    - no drops outside of dungeons and raids
    the games prefers the 'power gamers' with 'a main character'. even guilds are very not alts friendly - which is so obvious they should be ACCOUNT based and not CHARACTER based!
    We cannot send global texts (well, not for free), we cannot search for people. the community side of the game is really poor.

    Even-thought I'm far from being a designer myself, i support and like everything the OP said. And ms2 could be easily designed and balanced around community, design and battle.
    But the devs chose to throwaway the two elements and stay with gear and power gamers focus alone.
    UllPinkFoxxyAgent_DragonfuryHenryethaAnOldGeezer
  • PinkFoxxyPinkFoxxy
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 1,090
    Posts: 66
    Member
    edited 8:44PM May 29, 2019
    Miahoo wrote: »
    I also saw ms2 like the OP did (well, with more battle focus elements) but I'm very disappointed nothing is developed and added to the community side of the game.
    - no new designs
    - no new house options
    - no new minigames
    - no new arcades
    - no new communications options
    - no drops outside of dungeons and raids
    THIS is Tea

    litterally the ONLY thing that attracted me to this game was how social it was. It was a game where you could finally be just as social as you are hardcore. You can visit peoples houses, go to parties, make freinds, learn music, as well as doing your typical mmorpg stuff.

    THAT, is what attracted me to this game. and i can tell because i didnt reach max level because i spent like 75% of my time having fun at queenstown, or at someones house, or exploring, or doing all of the side stuff.

    and it makes me dissapointed that NONE of that was every built upon. No new minigames, no new social events, or anything. Im the type that will litterally quit a game if i cant make any freinds, so i feel like thats what bored me away from this game.

    it angers me that the small but vocal group of harcore players were able to convince the devs to make the game less casual, just for those same people to just rage quit because the devs werent taking away ALL of the casualness and sociability. so now theres just a game changed to appeal to the hardcore players, but the hardcore players are gone.

    like can we have new maps for the racing minigame? Can we be able to unlock the new arcade games? can there be more ways to make freinds? can there be ways to advertise your house events more effeciently?

    but like fr, they really joined this game expecting for it to be like a regular mmo, and just raced to max level and upgrade gear and stuff and complained about how easy it was to do all of this
    giphy.gif
    Agent_DragonfuryMiahooSylqtAnOldGeezer
  • KiymoriKiymori
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 2,250
    Posts: 335
    Member
    edited 8:28AM May 30, 2019
    Bulbasaur wrote: »
    Thing is these "social" aspects were likely never going to maintain a large playerbase. You spend 2 weeks building a house... and then what? Some players may keep creating new, original designs, however the vast majority wouldn't bother. I agree social activities should be an integral part, but it should only be a compliment.

    Problem is the combat isn't even good; I'd give it a 3/10 at best. The combat is lackluster and monotonous for many reasons including:
    - No stat progression
    - No stat diversity
    - No diversity in skill function
    - Heavy emphasis on damage
    - Rote memorization of "mechanics" rather than actual thinking
    - Repetitive gameplay (dungeons/raids) that amounts to no grand purpose
    In addition, there are also many other factors that likely result in many players quitting.

    1.Fully agree on stat progression, there really isn't any other way to build your character that feels equally effective due to the hard caps on stats, and the way they decided to structure damage dealt to bosses. I understand in some ways no matter what they do there will always be 'the most optimal build for damage', but it is sad to see most of the stats in this really serve no purpose. Actually as the game stands right now, thief is probably the only class that can build two different ways and do very well.

    2.Also fully agree on the skill diversity, same deal as above, yes, there will always be a 'most optimal build', but it would be very nice to see a change in the way GMS2 structures builds, so you can actually enjoy different trees. With Awakening on KR, that is really the only time you are able to choose a build path, but that is only because they took time to make the awakening skills ALMOST equally useful on both sides.


    3.As far as the social aspect, I really do wish open world PvP was taken more seriously in this game, the overall mechanics actually give this game potential for fun PvP related drama, or interesting PvP mini games, but again, they would really need to beef up PvP defense so we aren't blowing up each other in a matter of seconds. It would actually bring some form of relevance to the other stats in the game and add another layer of 'self gratification' when you farm your PvE or PvP gear. If they can't be bothered to redo stats, just do what Raiderz did and just make a PvP potion that decreases the damage you receive by X amount for X amount of time and see if that works.


    Overall, I still like MS2, it just really feels sometimes like you are playing an advance Mobile game rather than an in depth MMO at times.
    AnOldGeezer
  • CMKyriosCMKyrios
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 3,325
    Posts: 251
    Administrator
    edited 10:56AM May 31, 2019
    There are a lot of aspects that make an MMORPG. I understand that for many, MapleStory 2 definitely seemed like a project you didn't have to take too seriously and could have fun doing anything that you wanted to.

    The latest updates really focused a lot on the vertical progression of a player. Because inherently the design of the game encouraged a somewhat hardcore mentality towards PVE, it was natural that we had to address a lot of the glaring concerns of this, especially with the P2W aspects of the game gutted.

    The Awakening update is a long over-due continuation of PVE. There haven't been new dungeons and raids in a very long time, and so it was definitely needed and tied in well with the concept of increasing your Job Rank. In the meantime, we've done our best to improve QOL in ways this game hasn't seen before in as many ways as possible to make it as least frustrating as possible.

    With most of these concerns addressed, we've talked about it a lot in recent broadcasts, but those awesome creative and social ideas that players have been suggesting - we want to look into them. We won't neglect increasing the ceiling for PVE players of course, but there's definitely a lot we'd like to see if we can improve, whether it be life skills, housing, social improvements, or things away from the dungeon scene that serve as a more lighthearted atmosphere to spend your free time.

    In the meantime, I've taken a bulk of this thread with it's feedback and forwarded it as a major topic of contention for our team to review.

    Thank you for being patient with us. Improving MapleStory 2 is a never-ending journey that we'll be working on for a long time. The history of Global MS2 after all doesn't even go beyond a single year yet and the game has changed significantly in just that short time.
    WantSumCandyPinkFoxxyDreamyUwU
  • IllIIlIllIIl
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 3,165
    Posts: 479
    Member
    edited 2:48PM May 31, 2019
    CMKyrios wrote: »
    The latest updates really focused a lot on the vertical progression of a player. Because inherently the design of the game encouraged a somewhat hardcore mentality towards PVE

    What are you talking about? A "hardcore" approach to content design is not exclusive to "vertical progression", you just need to put a stronger focus on gear diversity and put the high risk high reward type of gear hardcore players naturally gravitate towards behind content specifically designed for hardcore players.


    CMKyrios wrote: »
    With most of these concerns addressed

    Define "most", the majority of your progression is still an RNG fest. Gear enhancing is just a small part of it. Getting gear worth enhancing (and no I'm not talking about max rolls here, even the most hardcore players don't bother with this) is generally a lot worse than the enhancing prosses itself (good thing that there isn't a way to reroll the bonus attributes on your weapons, this might have come in handy here). It's still "two days dungeons five days go play something else" / "play alt to progress". Tell me, what's the point of rumbles having FF again? Oh you can finally use your main to gear up your alts... if you're a hardcore raider that is. If you have at least one char strong enough to farm ascended gear you can gear up your alts with ascended gear. Great, this is how it should work on every level not just the last one.
    Agent_Dragonfury
  • SylqtSylqt
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 1,305
    Posts: 86
    Member
    edited 4:37AM June 1, 2019
    Not only is there a long-due continuation of pve, but a long-due continuation of social/light-hearted aspects that have been teased to us through the UI since launch...

    It's just so so very frustrating at times to watch a small group of people clear content at super fast speed and scream for more and get what they want, whilst the majority of the pop are taking their time with things. I personally would be happy to wait patiently for balanced updates of pve AND social stuff, but I know that is not how everyone feels.

    I feel kind of downtrodden rn, because even though the new awakening content is amazing (ty nexon, you did a great job implementing it, it's seriously amazing), we also got no minigames, no new arcade things, no new world bosses, only 3 new maps to explore, nothing really different social-wise. I also understand that KMS2 itself is limited on these areas too and we pretty much have all they have to offer in terms of "light fun" stuff which sucks greatly lol. I know with the current pve content I will have a lot to look forward to, but I feel sad because I know PVE and raids and w/e will always be the focus no matter what.

    So whilst I understand and accept the team's decisions for the game recently, there's only so much time social players will wait to get new things to do other than dungeons and raids, which frankly, most social players don't even play the game for and weren't that interested in in the first place lol.

    I know us humble scrubs don't mean much in the long run in terms of "progression" of the game, a lot of us are happy as long as we get to do our own thing, But there's a difference between taking feedback and acting upon it.

    The biggest issues right now imho is the guild system. It's outdated and completely limited, we just have too little spaces for too many people who want to play, espcially as a game which encourages alt play (thanks, caps :p).
    As a social guild, it sucks to tell people "sorry you can't have any alts here, we have no space", espcially as an altoholic myself. A good suggestion mentioned earlier is just making the guild you pick account wide, or just remove the member limits entirely so we can actually have larger guilds without having a higher guild level (Casual guilds take a while to level as there is generally less organised participation, as most people have erratic timetables or barely time to play)
    It's also impossible to have a proper "officer" team in a guild, as the GM holds all the power. I really don't like this, and wish there was more options for permissions and ranks, especially so that you are able to manage the guild effectively if the GM is offline.

    oof i wrote an essay again.

    EDIT: Just want to point out too before I get the "omg u just want things for free"/"omg u shud play [insert chat site] instead of ms2"/"casuals ruin all games", I'm perfectly happy with the current gear system and the amount of effort you have to put in (was also fine with how it was before PNL), and I'm fine with taking a wayyyy longer amount of time to complete these things because well... I'm a casual/socal player, ofc I don't play as much or as many alts.The majority of casual/socials don't care how long it takes, or *shock* what their gear score is, as long as they are enjoying themselves. The small vocal minority do not speak for everyone, same as I do not speak for everyone (I might be completely wrong for example, but from my limited experience this is the opinion I get from my fellow casuuls too, it's only very few who complain about gear and they are the ones who quit).
    In fact if you read the entirety of this thread, noone who agree with the OP asked for quicker gearscore, or easier way to get gear, they asked for fun things to do too away from the raiding scene. The only posts making it about gear score and gear are the people who care about those things.
    PinkFoxxyAnOldGeezer
  • SomeRandomGuySomeRandomGuy
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 475
    Posts: 18
    Member
    I am and at same time not suprised that ppl think its the hardcoreplayers who "changed" this game. Even after stating themselfs that hardcorers are a tiny fraction.

    You gotta wake up folks, its all about money! Sure there are some passionate devs but their company doesnt really care if the product underperforms.
    I can guarantee you before a game gets presented to the board they have to pitch the monetasation, yes, even if it has been out for several year on other regions.

    Everything has its meaning, monetary meaning!
    Timegating
    Drop chance
    RNG
    Contend


    With big data its really easy to find out what bring in most money, be it milking whales. Though i dont see ms2 catering to whales.
  • ÄrtÄrt
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 1,380
    Posts: 200
    Member
    edited 8:07PM June 1, 2019
    I'm not sure what is point of this game after awakening update. 3 new raids are extremely easy with minimum gs required or even below ít, emerald prison is pretty easy below required gs and i can't imagine other 2 rgb are any different but will have to wait till next week to try. This whole game is basically just time locks now, 2 months or something to even enter nexus but why would you want to do that, so you can solo lvl 50 raids later ? idk. Guy on stream showed 1 bil parse, but what's the point of it when theres nothing that requires it.
  • TassyTassy
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 6,740
    Posts: 532
    Member
    I haven't made a comment in quite a while. The past several months I've been extremely busy, but for the Awakening Update I made time to start playing again. I too fell in love with Maplestory 2's social aspects. Hanging around in people's houses and getting to know all of my guild members was memorable and very enjoyable for me. Those were the most fun parts of Maplestory 2.

    When I came back for the Awakening update, I was very saddened to see that almost every channel except channel 1 had people in it. I settled with channel 1 and would go around trying to talk to people for hours, but no one would talk to me besides one person. I very much miss the bustling community of the beta and early launch. I miss chilling with people.

    That being said, this does seem like it requires a combined effort from both the devs and community. Social converse comes from the community itself, whereas more enticing mediums of social play needs to be provided by the devs.

    There are plenty of grind heavy mmorpgs out there, but Maplestory has social aspects that most other current-day mmorpgs don't have, and I really feel like Mapleatory 2 needs to capatilize more on this. Yes, there are alternatives like Gaia Online, but those games are vastly outdated. Maplestory 2 seemed like the gradual progression and evolution upon those types of games.

    I don't think the rpg elements of the game should suffer. These recent updates are also really nice. More dungeons, classes, and RNG suppressants are great. The next focus should be to give more incentive for the community to delve into hanging out socializing, and sharing custom content though. This will lead to more staying power. I'm not sure what Club Penguin and Gaia did to provide a chilling atmosphere, but take notes and try to figure out how and why.

    As a side note, I don't particularly agree with some of the comments that "Maplestory 2 might not be striving to reach your expectations of what Maplestory 2 should be" (paraphrasing). The groundwork for a social game is all there and it was definitely part of the marketed vision provided for us, especially during the beta.

    Sylqt
  • PinkFoxxyPinkFoxxy
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 1,090
    Posts: 66
    Member
    edited 9:35AM June 4, 2019
    Tassy wrote: »
    I don't think the rpg elements of the game should suffer. These recent updates are also really nice. More dungeons, classes, and RNG suppressants are great. The next focus should be to give more incentive for the community to delve into hanging out socializing, and sharing custom content though. This will lead to more staying power. I'm not sure what Club Penguin and Gaia did to provide a chilling atmosphere, but take notes and try to figure out how and why.

    Heres my suggestions to the devs for improving social aspects. idk how much power we have on the global version as far as implementing new content wise, but as much as i can help, i will.

    - World chat/Channel chat shouldnt have as such harsh restrictions to use. If bots are the problem, i think being able to hide/mute spam comments, flagged bots, or players under level 25 from appearing in your world chat would be a good workaround this. But everyone would be able to use the chat.
    - Ik alot of players are against this, but merging the 2 US servers would be good for the playerbase, pretty much doubling the amout of players on the server

    NOW for new contentttt :)
    - New minigames, such as a mario kart minigame with many maps/powerups similar to the mount quest.
    - New Zombie minigame similar to the one on Snapchat's Bitmoji Party
    - Speaking of zombies, a zombie outbreak game mode, in the special dungeon category would be fun. Where you are put into a lobby with other players and choose a map, and basically fight the zombies and stuff.
    - new dungeon type, which has 2 players, which require teamwork and puzzles, requiring you and your partner to actually TALK, and work together. because people dont really do that tbh.
    - New Fun hangout maps, similar to queenstown, where you can hangout with your freinds, like a beach, a carnival/theme park, a water park, a spa
    - being able to duel with your freinds in the open world
    - Social Events, such as fashion shows, and pet shows
    -Better ways to advertise your house and your house events
    - Bard class (this isnt a social suggestion, i just really want a bard lol)



    TassySylqtAnOldGeezer
  • TassyTassy
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 6,740
    Posts: 532
    Member
    PinkFoxxy wrote: »
    Tassy wrote: »
    I don't think the rpg elements of the game should suffer. These recent updates are also really nice. More dungeons, classes, and RNG suppressants are great. The next focus should be to give more incentive for the community to delve into hanging out socializing, and sharing custom content though. This will lead to more staying power. I'm not sure what Club Penguin and Gaia did to provide a chilling atmosphere, but take notes and try to figure out how and why.

    Heres my suggestions to the devs for improving social aspects. idk how much power we have on the global version as far as implementing new content wise, but as much as i can help, i will.

    - World chat/Channel chat shouldnt have as such harsh restrictions to use. If bots are the problem, i think being able to hide/mute spam comments, flagged bots, or players under level 25 from appearing in your world chat would be a good workaround this. But everyone would be able to use the chat.
    - Ik alot of players are against this, but merging the 2 US servers would be good for the playerbase, pretty much doubling the amout of players on the server

    NOW for new contentttt :)
    - New minigames, such as a mario kart minigame with many maps/powerups similar to the mount quest.
    - New Zombie minigame similar to the one on Snapchat's Bitmoji Party
    - Speaking of zombies, a zombie outbreak game mode, in the special dungeon category would be fun. Where you are put into a lobby with other players and choose a map, and basically fight the zombies and stuff.
    - new dungeon type, which has 2 players, which require teamwork and puzzles, requiring you and your partner to actually TALK, and work together. because people dont really do that tbh.
    - New Fun hangout maps, similar to queenstown, where you can hangout with your freinds, like a beach, a carnival/theme park, a water park, a spa
    - being able to duel with your freinds in the open world
    - Social Events, such as fashion shows, and pet shows
    -Better ways to advertise your house and your house events
    - Bard class (this isnt a social suggestion, i just really want a bard lol)



    These are really nice ideas! My favorite three are the "more hangout places", "co-op puzzle dungeons" and fashion shows.

    You're right though that we might not have enough influence in requesting changes to the core game.. That's what makes this so difficult.

    Moderators, could we have more insight on how much power and influence the global devs have on the core game?
    PinkFoxxy