Check out the patch notes for the v18 Kritias Expansion here: http://forums.maplestory2.nexon.net/discussion/45974

What's up with the low population?

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  • NahoNaho
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    edited 6:30AM April 26, 2019
    IllIIl wrote: »
    Naho wrote: »
    When the difficulty is in the fact that it is tedious, yes it does. Or atleast for them ..

    Except like you said:

    Naho wrote: »
    barely anyone cared about the difficulties since they were easy to begin with.

    I was talking about the raids ... but my bad should have mentionned
  • BulbasaurBulbasaur
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    edited 6:35AM April 26, 2019
    Naho wrote: »
    90% of the "Feedback" were about making the progression easier

    90% of the 9% of the 9% who bother giving feedback and who still play. Basically a very small number of players. Nexon has lost most of their playerbase already. Listening to a small subset of active players isn't likely going to have a profound impact on the state of the game if their idea of a game is very different to what the people who quit early like to see in a game.
  • NahoNaho
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    Bulbasaur wrote: »
    Naho wrote: »
    90% of the "Feedback" were about making the progression easier

    90% of the 9% of the 9% who bother giving feedback and who still play. Basically a very small number of players. Nexon has lost most of their playerbase already. Listening to a small subset of active players isn't likely going to have a profound impact on the state of the game if their idea of a game is very different to what the people who quit early like to see in a game.

    Hold on. i was talking about when everything started tho.
  • BulbasaurBulbasaur
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    Naho wrote: »
    Bulbasaur wrote: »
    Naho wrote: »
    90% of the "Feedback" were about making the progression easier

    90% of the 9% of the 9% who bother giving feedback and who still play. Basically a very small number of players. Nexon has lost most of their playerbase already. Listening to a small subset of active players isn't likely going to have a profound impact on the state of the game if their idea of a game is very different to what the people who quit early like to see in a game.

    Hold on. i was talking about when everything started tho.

    Oh ok.
  • WantSumCandyWantSumCandy
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    there was over 40,000 people online yesterday. there was less then 2,000 on before the patch.

    people came back. servers lagged hard because of the unexpected population gains.

    (you don't expect a 2000% increase in margins overnight, you expect this in 8 weeks)

    now that the progression and FF problems are fixed the 38,000 people who came back will tell their friends that its fixed but its lagging atm (which is understandable because its like a day 1 release all over again) and they'll come back too. with the update coming in May (Striker/Level 60 Dungeon content) or Awakening 1 + Level 99 Cap(Lvl 99 takes years but level 70 takes weeks to months) followed by Zakum after one of these updates or both of these updates (the most iconic boss of Maplestory behind the Black Mage) will surely bring back the player total population to over 80,000 (not quite day 1 Levels but enough to be considered a top 10 most played MMORPG)
    Defraglife
  • HersikHersik
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    edited 9:56AM April 26, 2019
    with the update coming in May (Striker/Level 60 Dungeon content) or Awakening 1 + Level 99 Cap(Lvl 99 takes years but level 70 takes weeks to months) followed by Zakum after one of these updates or both of these updates (the most iconic boss of Maplestory behind the Black Mage) will surely bring back the player total population to over 80,000 (not quite day 1 Levels but enough to be considered a top 10 most played MMORPG)

    New class is only tmp injection to increase player base... Ppl will try it, thanks total ridiculus fast lvl progression make 60 in instant and thanks saved money max this class fast.. so it will be worth max for newcomers to enjoy it but with situation about raids and casual players which still will remain after this patch you will again starting lose players...

    For current players to stay, team decreased difficulty so you don't runs dungeons hours but it also caused some of current problems...

    This game offers nothing for casual players - wanna play game ? you need to find guild or have friends to get somewhere because you have and mostly now only one way how to get progress to your character (raids/dungeons) - In simple way you need to become hardcore player for griding where you won't even enjoy dungeons due to speed which you will mostly do that...

    This game is empty and based only on one thing, because side content got ignored in developing.. You have big game world with world bosses which gives you except achievements nothing... Crafting is only as support thing or again achievements, though it could be one of way to get progression too (look to other mmorpgs or even simple good rpg games)

    Fortress gave us little enjoy of game due to new questing but it only solo way how to get basic items before you go to dungeons or only way because before update you hadn't other choice without players or guild... Now update will force players, mostly for income, to do dungeons, so random search will maybe find somebody like it was in first months of game release but that only increase that one side of content in this game...

    I'm one of players which came back and after some time after making new character left again and idk if even new content will bring me back because of problems which i described above + even if you will in your mind saying "just find a guild" i need to ask for all casual players.. Which guild here will offer place for casual player which don't play in hardcore way how others here due to time as soon on...

    New players need to love running dungeons because this is only thing which you can do here... Story is good but animation in there and background music is weak not even synchronized sometimes...
    You need fix side content of game if you want make more players to stay and yes mostly of (if) replies on this post will be "that wont be immediately" but thing is it wouldn't even be necessary if this part was handled before releasing game...

    Btw if new main content like story will be in same speed then nobody will enjoy it because they will rush it and that you will have increased lvl cap but only way how to progress will be same griding, will bring players to boring state once again and life circle of game will be repeated

    To sum it up:
    To get stable players you need fix these big problems otherwise players will come, try get on first ending part and leave...
  • PeepPeep
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    Ärt wrote: »
    snip

    That's always what majority of feedback was. Past frustrations of sitting on dust for 3 months after failing 10 times total you mean.

    You're saying they are sticking but from what I see they arent, even today I saw guy shout in world chat "see ya in a month, back to wow" . Even people who come back instantly quit just because they have nobody to play with. Listening to everything is never good because people never have enough of free. Here you are calling it slight increase and yet it was very important to you to cap out everything with as little effort as possible, you argued against logic and reason just to get that at all cost. Probably because it's not slight increase at all, but gigantic one. Today I was in random pug cpap, it took 5 min so it's absolutely ridiculous lol, oh and it was 8 man too. Now here we are, content connected to leveling gems basically doesnt exist, I maxed everything before reset by only semi saving for 2 weeks after announcement. Theres nothing to do, people already completed this new event on first day which im assuming will last whole month and run around in cat suits.

    At this point this doesnt even resemble mmo, where you work towards something and then are proud of achieving it. It's just some casual thing you play for 20 min every couple days.

    The problem here is you and Naho both think rng is tied to difficulty which is why you make comments like "90% of player feedback - we want everything to be as easy as possible in game without content". While there are a crapload of terrible players in this game, most people simply wanted to have enough damage to participate in raids initially. I remember it all very clearly. I was in one of the first handful of groups that cleared dev, moc and pap on my server first week and back then we had to kick a couple members because they weren't "geared enough" and were not pulling high enough numbers due to factors such as not having an epic pet, not having high enough gems etc. All things that you can be rng gated by. Imagine being excluded despite putting in roughly the same amount of grind as all your other members and in some cases more. It's absolutely terrible and it's the reason why people wanted things changed to begin with. People should be rewarded based on the time they put in, not whether or not they got lucky.

    Difficulty in this game is tied to raids/dungeons/pvp. Not rng based progression.

    Nexon takes our feedback and produces their own solution for the problem. I don't remember anyone ever making the suggestion for 100% gems. At the same time it's the most frustrating part of Maplestory 2. With that being said, do you really think they have nothing planned in the future if they're going to make it 100%?

    It was a decent increase but nothing too crazy. My group was already doing 5min pap runs before this update even arrived. It just made them a min or 2 faster.

    There hasn't been anything to do for months for people who have been playing since launch and are raid oriented players. Once you clear the raids for the first time, it progressively keeps getting easier and easier. Most people see themselves as done once they finish the top content and have a max enchanted weapon. Until then it's sitting around capping out and waiting for the next portion of content to arrive.

    As for your last comment, it depends on the person. Anyone who has cleared the raid with their group for the first time and worked towards clearing it will feel proud about it. That's always been a part of many MMOs including this one. Of course for anyone who's at current endgame there's barely anything to do or achieve anymore as you have already achieved it. AKA clearing all content.
    SylqtHersik
  • NahoNaho
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    edited 2:36PM April 26, 2019
    Peep wrote: »
    The problem here is you and Naho both think rng is tied to difficulty which is why you make comments like "90% of player feedback - we want everything to be as easy as possible in game without content". While there are a crapload of terrible players in this game, most people simply wanted to have enough damage to participate in raids initially. I remember it all very clearly. I was in one of the first handful of groups that cleared dev, moc and pap on my server first week and back then we had to kick a couple members because they weren't "geared enough" and were not pulling high enough numbers due to factors such as not having an epic pet, not having high enough gems etc. All things that you can be rng gated by. Imagine being excluded despite putting in roughly the same amount of grind as all your other members and in some cases more. It's absolutely terrible and it's the reason why people wanted things changed to begin with. People should be rewarded based on the time they put in, not whether or not they got lucky.

    Difficulty in this game is tied to raids/dungeons/pvp. Not rng based progression.

    Nexon takes our feedback and produces their own solution for the problem. I don't remember anyone ever making the suggestion for 100% gems. At the same time it's the most frustrating part of Maplestory 2. With that being said, do you really think they have nothing planned in the future if they're going to make it 100%?

    It was a decent increase but nothing too crazy. My group was already doing 5min pap runs before this update even arrived. It just made them a min or 2 faster.

    There hasn't been anything to do for months for people who have been playing since launch and are raid oriented players. Once you clear the raids for the first time, it progressively keeps getting easier and easier. Most people see themselves as done once they finish the top content and have a max enchanted weapon. Until then it's sitting around capping out and waiting for the next portion of content to arrive.

    As for your last comment, it depends on the person. Anyone who has cleared the raid with their group for the first time and worked towards clearing it will feel proud about it. That's always been a part of many MMOs including this one. Of course for anyone who's at current endgame there's barely anything to do or achieve anymore as you have already achieved it. AKA clearing all content.

    I played this game solo, and did progress solo. There was nothing in raid nor pvp stoppping me from progressing beside the "lack of exp" . I could do more damage as a Tank build knight than 50% of the team, yet some of them had more gear than me. There was nothing difficult in raiding, ppl just wanted to clear their stuff asap and not waste time on stupid wipe, hence why they wanted geared player, because with geared player you could even skip mechanics.

    The toxicity and the so called "elitism" from this community also made things difficult for new/low geared player with fairfight on the top.

    Peep wrote: »
    Difficulty in this game is tied to raids/dungeons/pvp. Not rng based progression

    Highly doubt about that. Once you know the mechanics and know how to play your class , you will know how to deal proper damage.
    You said it yourself :
    Peep wrote: »
    Once you clear the raids for the first time, it progressively keeps getting easier and easier. Most people see themselves as done once they finish the top content and have a max enchanted weapon. Until then it's sitting around capping out and waiting for the next portion of content to arrive

    Hence why i said the the difficulty in this game , according to them was the Rng based progression, has it could be constantly denying from a supposed goal. Atleast that what they all thought hence why they wanted the rng to be removed. I never cared much about the Rng anyway and never will. I've seen worse than that. This game Rng is cute compare to what i already played.
  • BulbasaurBulbasaur
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    edited 5:22PM April 26, 2019
    there was over 40,000 people online yesterday. there was less then 2,000 on before the patch.

    Where did you get this number from? According to Steam charts, the player count increased by ~3% from last week from a peak count of ~1500 players.
    Defraglife
  • PeepPeep
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    edited 8:10PM April 26, 2019
    Naho wrote: »
    I played this game solo, and did progress solo. There was nothing in raid nor pvp stoppping me from progressing beside the "lack of exp" . I could do more damage as a Tank build knight than 50% of the team, yet some of them had more gear than me. There was nothing difficult in raiding, ppl just wanted to clear their stuff asap and not waste time on stupid wipe, hence why they wanted geared player, because with geared player you could even skip mechanics.

    The toxicity and the so called "elitism" from this community also made things difficult for new/low geared player with fairfight on the top.
    Peep wrote: »
    Difficulty in this game is tied to raids/dungeons/pvp. Not rng based progression

    Highly doubt about that. Once you know the mechanics and know how to play your class , you will know how to deal proper damage.
    You said it yourself :
    Peep wrote: »
    Once you clear the raids for the first time, it progressively keeps getting easier and easier. Most people see themselves as done once they finish the top content and have a max enchanted weapon. Until then it's sitting around capping out and waiting for the next portion of content to arrive

    Hence why i said the the difficulty in this game , according to them was the Rng based progression, has it could be constantly denying from a supposed goal. Atleast that what they all thought hence why they wanted the rng to be removed. I never cared much about the Rng anyway and never will. I've seen worse than that. This game Rng is cute compare to what i already played.

    Yeah and your lack of exp is what makes it difficult. Rng would have also prevented you. Gear isn't the only thing that's going to let you pass a raid. That's why you have people who have +13 or more today wiping consistently before the 3rd phase in Pap. They don't know what the hell they are doing and haven't gotten used to the mechanics so the raid is incredibly difficult for them. Just look at the Maplestory 2's inferno rog or pap run they had on stream as an example.

    Nothing difficult in raiding? I assume you're a day 1 clearer then? The timing was already incredibly tight when I first fought Dev and cleared it. We had around 10-20 seconds left even after doing the fight perfectly. To pass it you needed everyone to get the jumps every single time have high dps uptime. It didn't matter how good of a player you were, if you didn't pass certain enchant levels and did not have certain gems you were not going to have the damage required. That's plain and simple facts. This is exactly why people were getting kicked from the first raid clear groups. They kicked them so they could bring in other top players who were more geared so they'd have a better chance at clearing the raid.

    Once you are good with the mechanics of course it's going to be easier but that's not because it was always easy. That just means it was difficult at the start and progressively got easier as you did it more. Unless you cleared in the first 30 mins of the raids being released you really cannot tell me that it was easy because it simply wasn't.

    This game is time gated so you really didn't have many options if you got screwed over by the crappy system they had in place. Getting denied from progressing isn't what makes things difficult. You could go into the raid after your 100th attempt and know the mechanics well and you'd get to the point where everything is done perfectly and is no longer hard but you find you still cannot clear because the damage output isn't high enough due to the gear you have. You're still trying to tie difficulty to rng when it simply acts as a wall that prevents you from moving forward based on your luck. Difficulty is tied to things that are hard, take skill or require immense amounts of effort.
  • DanteYodaDanteYoda
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    Raising prices for creating gear ruined it for me far too expensive to post new gears so i quit and never came back.. Until they change that i never will.
  • MasturbaconMasturbacon
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    edited 9:17PM April 26, 2019
    now that the progression and FF problems are fixed the 38,000 people who came back will tell their friends that its fixed but its lagging atm (which is understandable because its like a day 1 release all over again) and they'll come back too. with the update coming in May (Striker/Level 60 Dungeon content) or Awakening 1 + Level 99 Cap(Lvl 99 takes years but level 70 takes weeks to months) followed by Zakum after one of these updates or both of these updates (the most iconic boss of Maplestory behind the Black Mage) will surely bring back the player total population to over 80,000 (not quite day 1 Levels but enough to be considered a top 10 most played MMORPG)

    This is wishful thinking. I returned after quitting in November to play the game with two friends who decided to install it, and already they are getting bored and quitting after reaching level 60. People keep mentioning upcoming content for MapleStory 2, but the question is, what gear score and stats do you need to actually be able to do that content? Nexon needs to make it so that players can actually participate in whatever content they are planning to add to the game, not create content that is basically exclusive for the hardcore players who have the time, money, or luck to have acquired the highest tier of gear and also the right attributes on their gear for completing said content. That, or they need to make it easier/cheaper for players to obtain what is required by both the community and by the game's own design otherwise they are not going to gain anybody new for very long. You can have 80,000 people playing the game but if they lose interest in the game after a few weeks because of how Nexon has chosen to develop the game, then the numbers are trivial. The trick is to actually maintain that population while it continually increases over time, you can't just keep focusing on implementing end-game content like what I imagine Zakum will be, when the progression to accessing that content is tedious and frustrating.

    From what I remember, this game relied heavily upon very specific stats in the end-game so has that changed any? Has Nexon balanced or reworked stat priority? Have they managed to create viability in other build types or is this still a game where everybody is playing the same exact character, just different skills? That's not an MMORPG to me, if so. I wouldn't say progression has been completely fixed, they simply just improved it slightly.

    Say what you will to defend the game, but with MapleStory 2 in its current state, I can't see the MMORPG thriving for as long as what Guild Wars 2 and Elder Scrolls Online did/have, for example, and the goal for every developer should be to create a game with longevity. MapleStory 2 requires many improvements before it ever becomes a "top 10 most played" video game. Perhaps they can start with expanding their crafting menus and allowing us to actually craft more than just mostly useless consumables and gear that isn't low quality and also not temporary, like plenty of other MMORPGS do. Nexon needs to take a page out of MMOs that have been successful in maintaining an active and consistent population, that also have a predominantly American playerbase because our culture and interests differ extremely from foreign players. What works with Korean MapleStory 2 might not work with American MapleStory 2 and they have to understand their audience.
  • ArurauneAruraune
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    Nexon needs to make it so that players can actually participate in whatever content they are planning to add to the game, not create content that is basically exclusive for the hardcore players who have the time, money, or luck to have acquired the highest tier of gear and also the right attributes on their gear for completing said content.

    That's going pretty much exactly like you want. There will be probably gear given via Navigator or catch-up packages or something for catching up to Lv.60 Hard Dungeons.
    From what I remember, this game relied heavily upon very specific stats in the end-game so has that changed any?

    No, stats stays same and aren't very hard to get with the amount of epic armors rerollers we get from Tris or Black Market for Legendary Armor or Epic Accessories. There's a high chance we'll be getting a lot of unique/named accessories like Kandura's Pendant that have fixed stats and are best-in-slot for majority of the builds.
    Say what you will to defend the game, but with MapleStory 2 in its current state, I can't see the MMORPG thriving for as long as what Guild Wars 2 and Elder Scrolls Online did/have, for example, and the goal for every developer should be to create a game with longevity.

    Also, a lot of MMOs starts in a decent/average/bad shape and get better over time. Remember Ragnarok? It was really bad on release. We're like not even 1 year into official release yet and things are getting a lot better regarding game mechanics.
    What works with Korean MapleStory 2 might not work with American MapleStory 2 and they have to understand their audience.

    They already know that very well and that's why we're getting some exclusive changes here and there, including the 100% chance Gemstone upgrade which is exclusive to GMS2.

    Also, DPS/Damage wise everyone will be able to do the same content given that you have a decent time played (example: Lv.60 raids) or play the intermediate content that prepares everyone for the raids/end-game (example: Lv.60 hard dungeons etc). Also, combat with Awakening/new skills are way better and more fun (I played KMS2 a bit for testing them and can confirm).
  • WantSumCandyWantSumCandy
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    Bulbasaur wrote: »
    there was over 40,000 people online yesterday. there was less then 2,000 on before the patch.

    Where did you get this number from? According to Steam charts, the player count increased by ~3% from last week from a peak count of ~1500 players.

    steamcharts do not represent the whole population.

    there are several population count sites and data-mining sites that are easy to find. 99% of the players use Nexon Launcher.
  • BulbasaurBulbasaur
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    edited 8:01AM April 27, 2019
    Say what you will to defend the game, but with MapleStory 2 in its current state, I can't see the MMORPG thriving for as long as what Guild Wars 2 and Elder Scrolls Online did/have, for example, and the goal for every developer should be to create a game with longevity. MapleStory 2 requires many improvements before it ever becomes a "top 10 most played" video game. Perhaps they can start with expanding their crafting menus and allowing us to actually craft more than just mostly useless consumables and gear that isn't low quality and also not temporary, like plenty of other MMORPGS do. Nexon needs to take a page out of MMOs that have been successful in maintaining an active and consistent population, that also have a predominantly American playerbase because our culture and interests differ extremely from foreign players. What works with Korean MapleStory 2 might not work with American MapleStory 2 and they have to understand their audience.

    Problem is the devs try to adopt the MapleStory 1 model of gameplay. The combat has no real depth. There are no real meaningful builds in this game, e.g. pure STR build, DEF/tank build, DEX/Agility build, etc. like you have in other games. The skills are lacking in diversity and creativity. The game is very one dimensional as the most important stat, by far, is your damage; most of the other stats are quite redundant. There is no real strategy or thinking involved for (most of) the dungeon/raid content. Simply put, from a combat perspective, this game looks like it was designed by and for 8 year olds. There are also additional issues pertaining to map usage, equipment requirements, diversity of the content, current production skills, etc. but I believe this lackluster combat is one of the biggest problems.
  • NahoNaho
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    edited 10:00AM April 27, 2019
    Peep wrote: »
    Naho wrote: »
    I played this game solo, and did progress solo. There was nothing in raid nor pvp stoppping me from progressing beside the "lack of exp" . I could do more damage as a Tank build knight than 50% of the team, yet some of them had more gear than me. There was nothing difficult in raiding, ppl just wanted to clear their stuff asap and not waste time on stupid wipe, hence why they wanted geared player, because with geared player you could even skip mechanics.

    The toxicity and the so called "elitism" from this community also made things difficult for new/low geared player with fairfight on the top.
    Peep wrote: »
    Difficulty in this game is tied to raids/dungeons/pvp. Not rng based progression

    Highly doubt about that. Once you know the mechanics and know how to play your class , you will know how to deal proper damage.
    You said it yourself :
    Peep wrote: »
    Once you clear the raids for the first time, it progressively keeps getting easier and easier. Most people see themselves as done once they finish the top content and have a max enchanted weapon. Until then it's sitting around capping out and waiting for the next portion of content to arrive

    Hence why i said the the difficulty in this game , according to them was the Rng based progression, has it could be constantly denying from a supposed goal. Atleast that what they all thought hence why they wanted the rng to be removed. I never cared much about the Rng anyway and never will. I've seen worse than that. This game Rng is cute compare to what i already played.

    Yeah and your lack of exp is what makes it difficult. Rng would have also prevented you. Gear isn't the only thing that's going to let you pass a raid. That's why you have people who have +13 or more today wiping consistently before the 3rd phase in Pap. They don't know what the hell they are doing and haven't gotten used to the mechanics so the raid is incredibly difficult for them. Just look at the Maplestory 2's inferno rog or pap run they had on stream as an example.

    Nothing difficult in raiding? I assume you're a day 1 clearer then? The timing was already incredibly tight when I first fought Dev and cleared it. We had around 10-20 seconds left even after doing the fight perfectly. To pass it you needed everyone to get the jumps every single time have high dps uptime. It didn't matter how good of a player you were, if you didn't pass certain enchant levels and did not have certain gems you were not going to have the damage required. That's plain and simple facts. This is exactly why people were getting kicked from the first raid clear groups. They kicked them so they could bring in other top players who were more geared so they'd have a better chance at clearing the raid.

    Once you are good with the mechanics of course it's going to be easier but that's not because it was always easy. That just means it was difficult at the start and progressively got easier as you did it more. Unless you cleared in the first 30 mins of the raids being released you really cannot tell me that it was easy because it simply wasn't.

    This game is time gated so you really didn't have many options if you got screwed over by the crappy system they had in place. Getting denied from progressing isn't what makes things difficult. You could go into the raid after your 100th attempt and know the mechanics well and you'd get to the point where everything is done perfectly and is no longer hard but you find you still cannot clear because the damage output isn't high enough due to the gear you have. You're still trying to tie difficulty to rng when it simply acts as a wall that prevents you from moving forward based on your luck. Difficulty is tied to things that are hard, take skill or require immense amounts of effort.

    You've been saying in your post that it didn't matter how good you are you would be stuck somewhere because you lack of damage due to your low gear but you're trying to tell me it wasn't tied to the rng making things tedious "According to them" ? How exactly you could get a better gear other than Rng???

    I remember back to cbt ppl were saying dg were too easy, they said they made things harder, barely saw any difference
  • BulbasaurBulbasaur
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    edited 11:34AM April 27, 2019
    steamcharts do not represent the whole population.

    there are several population count sites and data-mining sites that are easy to find. 99% of the players use Nexon Launcher.

    You mean a site like this? https://mmo-population.com/r/maplestory2/. Cause that's the only site I can find, unless you can link to more. Actually if you look at the https://mmo-population.com/about page, it uses Reddit subscribers and online Reddit users and a bunch of random numbers, and explicitly states "This is more a fun project than anything else. It should be obvious to anyone the reasons why this is not an accurate subscriber count for MMOs. What it is though, is an interesting (to me and maybe others) tracker of popularity based on reddit users." So if you do the math using those random formulas, yes you get ~150k depending on the peak number of online Reddit users during the day.

    Other than that I don't know what sites you are looking at.
  • ArurauneAruraune
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    edited 1:50PM April 27, 2019
    Bulbasaur wrote: »
    So if you do the math using those random formulas, yes you get ~150k depending on the peak number of online Reddit users during the day.

    You do know that's a Total Player estimation instead of a Concurrent Players estimation right? While a Steam Chart game may show like 1500 players through the day, the total player count can be like ten times higher sometimes (when people logs in, complete things, then logout for the day, then "next group" [timezones, people getting home from work, going to study etc] do the same). Also, I'm just guessing here but from reddit users talking, new players, old players and etc, I'm guessing Nexon Launcher vs Steam is like a ~65% x ~35% ratio or something like this. I'm guessing the actual total/unique player count (daily) for Steam+Nexon Launcher considering the daily count drops through the week to be around ~45-60k players up to ~80-100k max (considering more players logging in to check new leaf updates). I wish steamspy didn't put the Total Player Count under a paywall, rip. Considering the many returning players posts on reddit (and on server, even guild) etc I think it's possible it can reach up to 120-130k unique players as of the current date so the website wouldn't be that actually *way too far off*.

    Why 65:35? Many players uses Nexon Launcher since Steam seems to drop FPS a bit, especially when it comes to older/long time players who are around since head start or earlier since there was no Steam version. Steam is most attractive to new players and also for SA because of regional pricing (still, some like me prefer to play from Nexon Launcher rather than Steam and only launch steam version for buying merets).
  • BulbasaurBulbasaur
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 2,525
    Posts: 233
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    Aruraune wrote: »
    You do know that's a Total Player estimation instead of a Concurrent Players estimation right? While a Steam Chart game may show like 1500 players through the day, the total player count can be like ten times higher sometimes (when people logs in, complete things, then logout for the day, then "next group" [timezones, people getting home from work, going to study etc] do the same).

    Ok sure, but you do know that those equations have no real intrinsic value right? So even if those numbers match closely with the total players for a particular day, it'd be a coincidence more than anything.
    Aruraune wrote: »
    Also, I'm just guessing here but from reddit users talking, new players, old players and etc, I'm guessing Nexon Launcher vs Steam is like a ~65% x ~35% ratio or something like this. I'm guessing the actual total/unique player count (daily) for Steam+Nexon Launcher considering the daily count drops through the week to be around ~45-60k players up to ~80-100k max (considering more players logging in to check new leaf updates). I wish steamspy didn't put the Total Player Count under a paywall, rip. Considering the many returning players posts on reddit (and on server, even guild) etc I think it's possible it can reach up to 120-130k unique players as of the current date so the website wouldn't be that actually *way too far off*.

    I doubt the total is that high. There's a lot of bots, afk players, and hardcores who play several hours a day.
  • ArurauneAruraune
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 4,485
    Posts: 181
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    edited 9:15PM April 27, 2019
    Bulbasaur wrote: »
    I doubt the total is that high. There's a lot of bots, afk players, and hardcores who play several hours a day.

    The previous MMO I played before had lower CCU (about ~980-1.9k at times) and the actual Total Player count was about 45k for a game that's steam-only (steam spy in the past, by Nov '17) . Assuming the 65:35 ratio, even discounting possible bots it should be at least higher than 45k since overall CCU for MS2 is higher than what we see on steamcharts currently.

    Applying the same ratio for these two games that runs under similar conditions (lot of daily/dungeons/alts) the number would be pushed to 83k, there wasn't a big update back then and we have on MS2, which is why I think it can go up to ~100k max from returning players/people checking the game after the recent updates.

    Let's take the 80k estimate and apply a "30% of that are bots/alts/etc" (same, estimate data from steamspy from some date later than that - about 30% owned 5 or less game on steam even though legit players might fall into this condition) -> we still get about 56k unique/total players.

    Even if we be conservative and apply the estimate only by steam numbers we get 31.5k unique players (70% of 45k) which mostly represents steam unique players and excludes the estimates from Nexon Launcher assuming the ratio I said before.

    I'm going to repeat what I said in another thread, you probably read too many negative comments and probably also didn't look much into steamspy numbers (also, it's sad most of it is behind a paywall now, rip) or observed actual differences between Total Players and CCU. It's too easy to read CCU and think the whole population is a small number when, in the big picture, although still small, the size of the current community is still decent (and far higher than the Peak CCU number you see).

    You can argue with me that some of these players are the type that only logs in on Fridays and Saturday, get everything done and logout for the week - but that's fine, that's how Total Player count works and it's different from CCU. While CCU shows a lot of about a game's popularity it doesn't mean that the whole community is of its size, the entirety of us don't log in together at the same scheduled time after all.