Check out the patch notes for the v18 Kritias Expansion here: http://forums.maplestory2.nexon.net/discussion/45974

Removed original p2w concept but same game??????

SandoSando
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in General Chat
Like various people have pointed it out, Nexon listened to the community and removed all pay to win from the game BUT they did not change anything to the game...

The game has huge walls to promote shop items, but those were removed and now we just have huge walls...

Nexon you cannot just remove pay to win and keep the exact same game, you need to change the game to reflect that...

Like other game that were a monthly subscriptions and went free to play, they had to change a lot of things to support that model. You can just keep the same game and be like "there you go no more pay to win".
HuddyBuuuuuutwhYPkmdzEiseiNia

Comments

  • Sammich88Sammich88
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    edited 11:27AM December 12, 2018
    What would you suggest?

    Keep in mind that if anything you suggest isn't liked, you'll have to come up with different ideas each time to fit our liking.
    WallSeries
  • LeilafiLeilafi
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    Why can't you be happy with the game just being non p2w?
    Not many games are this way, but you're making a big deal out of it and being ungrateful about it, in the process.
  • BuuuuuutwhYBuuuuuutwhY
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    If all bots were banned and meso buying no longer possible, just opening 3 absolute accessories a day would bankrupt 99% of players. Forget opening sockets. People would barely be able to afford their first reroll of a legendary piece of armor. The meso sinks in this game are massive and don't match the average player's income. As of now, you must be benefiting from bot driven meso selling inflation in some form to be able to afford these RNG meso sinks. Buying mesos, selling services to meso buyers, selling RNG dungeon drops and epic pets at inflated prices. This is why there are those that suspect that Nexon owns the meso selling sites btw. You'd have to be incompetent or crooked to not only release the game in this state but then leave it this way for 2 months and counting.
    WallSeries
  • MochiAiMochiAi
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    If all bots were banned and meso buying no longer possible, just opening 3 absolute accessories a day would bankrupt 99% of players. Forget opening sockets. People would barely be able to afford their first reroll of a legendary piece of armor. The meso sinks in this game are massive and don't match the average player's income. As of now, you must be benefiting from bot driven meso selling inflation in some form to be able to afford these RNG meso sinks. Buying mesos, selling services to meso buyers, selling RNG dungeon drops and epic pets at inflated prices. This is why there are those that suspect that Nexon owns the meso selling sites btw. You'd have to be incompetent or crooked to not only release the game in this state but then leave it this way for 2 months and counting.

    I think they are just incompetent. It has come to a point where they can't even get rid of the bots nor punish the RMTers. Nexon just boxed themselves in a corner.
  • WhyWhyWhyWhy
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    edited 12:50PM December 12, 2018
    Removed p2w = omg look our progress is too slow

    With p2w = LOL is nexon ofc game is p2w nexon is cash grab

    what the fook do u guys want jesus

    i am sure nexon has the p2w game in mind , but due to overwhelming response from the community , nexon decides to try to listen to their playerbase and remove p2w , they did well so far listening to players , this kind of communication is unheard of in any MMO. but look what happens , Complains to complains to complains , people do not appreciate what is given and just want everything to be done their ways ( a reddit post with 50 upvote is not the voice of the community ).

    i wont even be mad if nexon just go back to original p2w because some part of the player base are just a bunch of entitle people. first people wanted more runs because 30 run a week is not enough for them since they want to play the game more ( they did not mention anything about they just want faster progression ) and then nexon gave us reset button, then the player finally notice that they only wanted faster progression and now asking for double loot button.
    LießStellaeoraInternetPersonNahoBabou
  • MochiAiMochiAi
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    WhyWhy wrote: »
    Removed p2w = omg look our progress is too slow

    With p2w = LOL is nexon ofc game is p2w nexon is cash grab

    what the fook do u guys want jesus

    Change the meso sink amount to begin, yeah? Yeyeyeyyee? Yeyyeyee?
    Nia
  • MochiAiMochiAi
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    WhyWhy wrote: »
    i wont even be mad if nexon just go back to original p2w because some part of the player base are just a bunch of entitle people. first people wanted more runs because 30 run a week is not enough for them since they want to play the game more ( they did not mention anything about they just want faster progression ) and then nexon gave us reset button, then the player finally notice that they only wanted faster progression and now asking for double loot button.

    Excellent idea! Go to my poll post and vote my good sir. Voters are winners! And winners vote!
    If you support p2w, you can vote yes.
  • WiLBoYWiLBoY
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    WhyWhy wrote: »
    Removed p2w = omg look our progress is too slow

    With p2w = LOL is nexon ofc game is p2w nexon is cash grab

    what the fook do u guys want jesus

    i am sure nexon has the p2w game in mind , but due to overwhelming response from the community , nexon decides to try to listen to their playerbase and remove p2w , they did well so far listening to players , this kind of communication is unheard of in any MMO. but look what happens , Complains to complains to complains , people do not appreciate what is given and just want everything to be done their ways ( a reddit post with 50 upvote is not the voice of the community ).

    i wont even be mad if nexon just go back to original p2w because some part of the player base are just a bunch of entitle people. first people wanted more runs because 30 run a week is not enough for them since they want to play the game more ( they did not mention anything about they just want faster progression ) and then nexon gave us reset button, then the player finally notice that they only wanted faster progression and now asking for double loot button.

    Correct. A large part of the population complain all day but actually have no idea what they want. No matter what is implemented there will always be complaints. Is the game perfect? No. But some of these complaints are unreasonable.

    Then again, every game is filled with complaints these days.
    StellaeoraNaho
  • ZyanidZyanid
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    I think the game was just fine the way it was released with game progression improved with the subsequent updates that were applied. Most of the major issues people have with the game in its current state can be tied back to the enormous influx of illicit mesos. Furthermore, all the fixes that were to combat the influence of meso sellers/buyers were implemented too late, when the irreversible damage to the game was already done.

    One of these issues is people experiencing stagnation in their current game progress. I don't think the reason why people feel this way has much to do with the designed progression of the game being too slow, rather it has more to do with people feeling left behind. The only reason why people would feel this way after less than 3 months of the game being released is that they are observing a large portion of the population advance too rapidly.

    Naturally, in a "RNG"-based game such as MS2, there will always be a small group of players (expanded only by veterans of past instances of the game) that will advance beyond the rest because that's how "RNG" works. Ideally, the player base would be stratified (for the most part) by the amount of time invested in the game, where those at the top are only a small group to start and will eventually grow throughout the life of the game. In order for a balanced stratification to be achieved sufficient amount of time has to pass.

    However, meso generation has allowed the "top group" to grow at too accelerated a pace and, most detrimentally, in a very unbalanced distribution between players. Furthermore, this large portion of players that have either directly (illegitimate players, i.e. meso buyers) or indirectly (players "blessed by RNG" with good drops, boss run sellers, etc.) benefited from meso generation have experienced an accelerated rate of progress, which has caused the rest of the players to perceive that rate as the norm, further feeding their sentiment of stagnation.

    I also argue that if meso generation didn't exist in the game, the current state of meso sinks would be a nonissue. The whole point of them is to limit the rate of inflation in the game, which is a good thing, considering how difficult it is to farm meso without relying on luck.

    Considering how the game has developed since release, I feel that Nexon intended MS2 to be f2p only temporarily, for experimental purposes. I think they had planned to implement p2w aspects sometime in the future, but now that their experiment has failed they'll have to implement these a lot sooner. Of course, if they do this anytime soon they'll lose the remaining f2p playerbase but at least the game will live on for a while longer.
    If Nexon truly intended to keep the game f2p for the foreseeable future, then they truly are incompetent. That is the only explanation on why they have allowed this game to degenerate as it has.
  • MochiAiMochiAi
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    Zyanid wrote: »
    I think the game was just fine the way it was released with game progression improved with the subsequent updates that were applied. Most of the major issues people have with the game in its current state can be tied back to the enormous influx of illicit mesos. Furthermore, all the fixes that were to combat the influence of meso sellers/buyers were implemented too late, when the irreversible damage to the game was already done.

    One of these issues is people experiencing stagnation in their current game progress. I don't think the reason why people feel this way has much to do with the designed progression of the game being too slow, rather it has more to do with people feeling left behind. The only reason why people would feel this way after less than 3 months of the game being released is that they are observing a large portion of the population advance too rapidly.

    Naturally, in a "RNG"-based game such as MS2, there will always be a small group of players (expanded only by veterans of past instances of the game) that will advance beyond the rest because that's how "RNG" works. Ideally, the player base would be stratified (for the most part) by the amount of time invested in the game, where those at the top are only a small group to start and will eventually grow throughout the life of the game. In order for a balanced stratification to be achieved sufficient amount of time has to pass.

    However, meso generation has allowed the "top group" to grow at too accelerated a pace and, most detrimentally, in a very unbalanced distribution between players. Furthermore, this large portion of players that have either directly (illegitimate players, i.e. meso buyers) or indirectly (players "blessed by RNG" with good drops, boss run sellers, etc.) benefited from meso generation have experienced an accelerated rate of progress, which has caused the rest of the players to perceive that rate as the norm, further feeding their sentiment of stagnation.

    I also argue that if meso generation didn't exist in the game, the current state of meso sinks would be a nonissue. The whole point of them is to limit the rate of inflation in the game, which is a good thing, considering how difficult it is to farm meso without relying on luck.

    Considering how the game has developed since release, I feel that Nexon intended MS2 to be f2p only temporarily, for experimental purposes. I think they had planned to implement p2w aspects sometime in the future, but now that their experiment has failed they'll have to implement these a lot sooner. Of course, if they do this anytime soon they'll lose the remaining f2p playerbase but at least the game will live on for a while longer.
    If Nexon truly intended to keep the game f2p for the foreseeable future, then they truly are incompetent. That is the only explanation on why they have allowed this game to degenerate as it has.

    Good point good point.
  • BaronLövatBaronLövat
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    Games not for you then. I guess.
    Personally, I don't like games that pander to instant gratification and rapid fire flashing of loot tier colors.

    But that's just me. The game has problems, but these "pay walls" honestly feel like there's further content that we don't have yet, that would relieve it.

    I mean, once you have an Epic 50 pet, you don't need G3's or Candy outside of at mos 3 a day for dailys.
    Once you +15 your weapons and get roughly +10 armor, Onyx becomes highly unimportant.
    Honestly, the ONLY thing I can think of that's a meso sink is the jewelry. Because there isn't legendary jewelry.

    If you're not sinking meso into pet fusions and crafting G3's or buying G3's and having the BM remove inflation via tax, where do you expect it to go?

    I suspect, quite heavily, Jewelry was designed to be precisely that, a massive meso sink that you take care of longer term and at upper end game. Everything else seems to be time gated.
  • ÄrtÄrt
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 1,380
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    edited 11:42PM December 12, 2018
    WhyWhy wrote: »
    Removed p2w = omg look our progress is too slow

    With p2w = LOL is nexon ofc game is p2w nexon is cash grab

    what the fook do u guys want jesus

    If you want balanced p2w experience then just find kssn on google, create korean account and go play there. Enjoy balanced attribute points on costumes that cost only 1-2k usd to level up and balanced extra dungeon runs that you can purchase for real money in balanced fashion. Even balanced cash titles that give balanced stats.

    I mean, if they launched game in that state almost nobody would play it here.


    People probably want way to earn gold in game that would be sufficient to cover all those gold sinks. Nexon doesnt seem to be interested in that however and goes in opposing direction by reducing gold gain while making gold botting easier. Which can only lead me to believe that theres some kind of deal in place between them and gold selling websites. Something along the lines of we will let you operate if you pay us % of your profits, making money is whole point of games like this anyway.

    As it stands you make like what, less than 250k from get rich dailies 90% of the time and 2 mil from 30 dungeon runs per week, 4 mil if you reset on your main plus some tradeable onyx gains of which were nerfed recently. You can't do almost anything with that. To make more you'd have to turn yourself into gold bot and farm solvent or new sky fortress quest required items, but youd be doing it by hand on single account. While real gold bots prolly multibox 50 clientless accounts on single pc without generating graphics and farm stuff just by sending packets. I'm guessing here based on other games i had experience with where that was possible, idk how advanced it is here by now but im prolly not far off. Either that or buying mesos, maxing your char and then selling runs to...you guessed it meso buyers. lol
    iinferno
  • ÄrtÄrt
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    edited 11:42PM December 12, 2018
    double post, dont see way to delete it on this forum
  • NahoNaho
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 1,850
    Posts: 182
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    edited 9:48AM December 13, 2018
    WhyWhy wrote: »
    Removed p2w = omg look our progress is too slow

    With p2w = LOL is nexon ofc game is p2w nexon is cash grab

    what the fook do u guys want jesus

    i am sure nexon has the p2w game in mind , but due to overwhelming response from the community , nexon decides to try to listen to their playerbase and remove p2w , they did well so far listening to players , this kind of communication is unheard of in any MMO. but look what happens , Complains to complains to complains , people do not appreciate what is given and just want everything to be done their ways ( a reddit post with 50 upvote is not the voice of the community ).

    i wont even be mad if nexon just go back to original p2w because some part of the player base are just a bunch of entitle people. first people wanted more runs because 30 run a week is not enough for them since they want to play the game more ( they did not mention anything about they just want faster progression ) and then nexon gave us reset button, then the player finally notice that they only wanted faster progression and now asking for double loot button.

    They literally cried to remove the p2w, but none of them thought about how that could affect the game. You got your wall , enjoy it now , you ask to remove something cuz p2w when it's not and now blame nexon because the game is how it was ?This community is such a joke i swear ... Gg wp ~
  • WallSeriesWallSeries
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    the p2w was there to fix the long ass boring gameplay but since the community wanted it gone, it is now gone and whatever’s left is a long ass boring gameplay....
    and they cant fix a long ass boring gameplay....

    p2w cash shop was to fix these time-gated RNG system but since the community wanted it gone, it is now gone and whatever’s left is a time-gated RNG system
    and they cant fix a time-gated RNG system
    BUT MESOS CAN, so there u have it