Check out the patch notes for the v17 Precursor Update here: http://maplestory2.nexon.net/en/news/article/53778/precursor-update-v17

"State of the Game Week 4" by Jungsoo Lee

NXACuddlesNXACuddles
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edited 1:50PM November 7, 2018 in Team Blogs
Update (Nov. 7): Dear Maplers,

After a thorough review of your feedback, we decided to make an adjustment to the Listing Fee structure one more time. We understand there are small UGC creators who need to test the market with smaller investments, and some regions have smaller number of listings, and as such Listing Fees will now work as follows:

- Zero items listed: 190 Merets to list a new design
- One item listed: 290 Merets to list a new design
- Two or more items listed: 390 Merets to list a new design

We strongly believe that having a reasonable entrance barrier to the market will increase the quality of the content players can shop for, and this will result in more players visiting the store. We have seen feedback that players do not want to visit the UGC store anymore because of an excess of low-quality creations making it harder to find great quality ones. This change should make it more appealing for players to visit the store regularly. Also, combined with 90-day listings and 5% more Merets going to the creators, this will let players create a more profitable business on the Design Shop.

We will carefully monitor the trend after this change, and if any further changes are required, we will take a look at the issue and respond accordingly. Since there will be items which have been registered before this change, thus please expect this change to create a noticeable impact after 3-4 weeks.

Best,
Jungsoo Lee


Dear Maplers,

This week’s update will be mainly focused on upcoming changes to UGC - mainly the Design Shop. Currently, we are seeing a truly massive number of creations from the community in the Design Shop, and in order to enhance the overall experience for both shoppers and creators we are going to make a few important changes.

Designer’s Shop Change

Objective of the Change

The main objective of the changes are to ensure that:
  1. We support great designers with creative mindset with better exposure and better revenue share structure
  2. We protect original creations from other players copying their designs
  3. We provide shoppers with a better experience, focusing on high quality and more creative designs
  4. We protect the shop from content which explicitly violates the Terms of Service - especially sexually suggestive/obscene, copyright and trademark designs
  5. We ensure review of the designs are based on clear guidelines, to avoid applying different standards to different designs

The Thought Process

We reviewed current design shop structure and noticed a few issues. Because the cost of registering items on the shop is free for the first one, and only slowly rising with additional listings, and because we are refunding the full Listing Fee when design submissions are removed from the Design Shop, we have seen many players blatantly copying another player’s design, or uploading the content which clearly violates the ToS without any risk of losing Merets.

This was hurting the shop in many ways:
  • Designs stolen from other creators were thrown into the shop with minimal risk
  • The shop became overloaded with designs that clearly violated ToS, again due to a lack of consequences
  • Because of the large number of low-effort designs, copying another creator’s design and offensive designs submitted by bad actors, many wonderful, original creations became buried in the shop

Thus, we have decided to tweak the shop fee structure to provide higher upside for the great content creators while better filtering out designs being submitted by bad actors.

Upcoming Changes

With the update on 11/8, we are going to change three things:
  • Listing Registration Fee will increase to a flat 490 Merets for all Design Shop listings
  • Creators will now get a 75% cut from the sales on the Design Shop, up from 70%
  • Registration Period will increase from 30 days to 90 days
  • Designs submitted in bad faith, with a clear intention to copy another creator’s original work or violate the ToS, will not be refunded, including both the listing fee and template cost (This will apply to the ad walls as well)

This change is to ensure that original creators have the potential to succeed in the shop. Also, by providing a 90 day registration period with a greater cut for the designers, we hope to see more meaningful creations and fewer items overloading the store, making the original creations harder to find.

Finally, by doing so, players duplicating designs to make easy Merets will now risk losing actual initial investments. We have a 10 day review period on Merets being delivered to creators, and will work to ensure that anyone who submits designs in bad faith will not be able to get any Merets from the sales and lose their original investments.

Review Process Improvements

The Customer Support staff handling the UGC submission and review process have been going through very tough times. We saw a much higher volume of creations coming in than expected, and lots of high level terms created confusion within the team. Additionally, since we work with teams in other countries, there are differing understandings of what is considered unacceptable. As a result, there were cases where some designs have been incorrectly removed. We sincerely apologize for your inconvenience and to improve this we have made a few internal changes to improve on our consistency:
  • We have added more details to our UGC review guidelines
  • We have simplified categories and criterias with detailed examples we have seen in the actual Design Shop
  • We are improving our training to ensure we are consistent when removing designs
  • We are reviewing tools which could help us automatically identify obvious violations, to allow our team to focus more on important reviews

While this might take more time to get to the level where everyone is satisfied, we promise you will see improvements in the UGC review process quickly, and please continue providing feedback if you see issues with our decisions.

Other Upcoming Changes

This week’s update will include few important improvements.

Fairfight Update: We are reducing the impact to players above Lv. 50, resulting in most players seeing a 10%+ increase in damage, and the classes with a high dependency on buffs and passives will see even greater damage increases

10053 Issue: We are adding a new feature to the game with Chaos Rising Update that helps mitigating disconnections on November 8th. This change will automatically seek to re-establish connection with the server, and it’s highly likely you won’t notice the disconnection after we apply the change. Some of the cases you will see loading icon on the center for very short time, but if you are experiencing long disconnections, you may see multiple reconnection attempts.

Please note that if you click Cancel during the reconnection attempt, you will be disconnected and receive the 10053 error. There are also a few edge cases that the game client will default to a disconnection with the error code, including but not limited to:
  • If the disconnection happens while loading into the game from character selection
  • If the disconnection happens while loading into mini-games or dungeons
  • If the disconnection happens while loading into new maps or channels

We expect most previously affected players will not see the 10053 issue after the update but we will keep monitoring to make sure. With this change, we hope to make everyone’s gameplay experience much more enjoyable.

Meso Seller and Bots: We are continuing to identify and block bots. Last week we have banned 30,000+ accounts and yesterday alone we have banned 10,000+ accounts. Also, to combat ad spams via walls and ad balloons we will be adding level requirements to use them. Also, whispers will now have a Lv. 25 requirement and group chats a Lv. 50 requirement. We are discussing additional measures and hope we can make gradual improvements to combat the bots without affecting your gameplay

Dungeon Limit Reset (BETA): It is finally coming to the game, please try out the dungeon limit reset beta feature and see how it is working for your daily grind. Remember, you can reset the limit only once per account each week, so choose your character wisely.

QoL Improvements: We are improving a few functions - house size reduction, Wardrobe Swap, Quickslot Bar swapping - also we are adding five different weapon templates for our talented designers!

Thanksgiving UPDATE!: We are going to celebrate the Thanksgiving with a ton of content. You will have the chance to earn a special turkey mount, decorations, outfits and other vanity items. Please look out for more details, and join us on Thanksgiving weekend for more!

December Teaser: We are already preparing our update for December, we will start to share some of the updates and improvements for December around Thanksgiving.

Optimization: This is still in our books, but we currently don’t have any details to share yet.

We will be providing much more detailed updates on the Chaos Raids with the patch notes and other announcements. While we thrive to deliver the best gaming experience to the community, some of the decisions might not seem perfect, and our actions might seem slow. We understand the expectation is high, and will work hard to improve ourselves to satisfy our great community. Please continue to provide us feedback, as while we might not be leaving comments on each individual comments, you can be assured we are reading and listing up the feedback to review.

This week is going to be huge for the community, and looking forward to see the community knocking off the Chaos Raids. It will be challenging but you will love it!

Sincerely,
Jungsoo Lee
MintyliciousSgoiltAliceWhatBeIIalunapyrite321DocDoomMaplestoryGuy

Comments

  • NinfetaminaNinfetamina
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 1,020
    Posts: 14
    Member
    Please lower the Merets price to the South American server.
    LouweDanDKPedroDocDoom
  • mewberimewberi
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 3,685
    Posts: 175
    Member
    edited 11:59AM November 8, 2018
    Please consider lowering it to 200 merets, we already pay a lot to make the template in the first place
    Edit: also next time you make changes to how much people can earn please be more transparent,
    the limit is now 100k and we still don't know how this affects the blue badge and title.
    Shadowing is not very professional at all.
    SyrusMarufujiCariseiSkybornemirta000MisoxShiruJicuZatchDanDKRozelisaCurkyand 8 others.
  • PizzaBearPizzaBear
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 1,795
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    mewberi wrote: »
    Please consider lowering it to 200 merets, we already pay a lot to make the template in the first place

    Isn't there free template voucher from daily boxes?
  • mewberimewberi
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 3,685
    Posts: 175
    Member
    PizzaBear wrote: »
    mewberi wrote: »
    Please consider lowering it to 200 merets, we already pay a lot to make the template in the first place

    Isn't there free template voucher from daily boxes?

    yes but it's rare and i've never got one lol
    Sherri
  • VillainyVillainy
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 510
    Posts: 3
    Member
    maybe I've missed it but have they said anything about the compensation they said they'd be giving to those who couldn't log in day 8 of head start. due to gmail log in not working.
    DanDKSherri
  • mirta000mirta000
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 8,275
    Posts: 512
    Member
    edited 2:14PM November 6, 2018
    Well that's me stopping using the UGC system all together then.
    I tried my best designing to my own best ability. Every design would take me 1-2 days. I WOULD NOT get my money back from templates and listing fees. (http://forums.maplestory2.nexon.net/discussion/37504/mirtas-creations-novice-quality my UGC page)
    Now I simply won't bother. I don't have 7$ to spend on a pair of gloves, nor 9$ to make a dress.

    I'm also not going to be supporting creators under such a crappy system.
    LouweCariseimewberiBakaAnikiGarlicBreadDanDKKodaigaArSkulderRozelisaCurkyand 6 others.
  • CariseiCarisei
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 2,190
    Posts: 40
    Member
    edited 2:34PM November 6, 2018
    We protect the shop from content which explicitly violates the Terms of Service - especially sexually suggestive/obscene, copyright and trademark designs
    You guys need to clearly define this. Things that are no more "sexually suggestive/obscene" then existing official cosmetics or anything else in the game for that matter have been getting removed when clearly that is not the actual issue. Ether it's the people you have going through the reports or your system is automated and doesn't know better. Ether way there is an issue there. Remember we've been through this whole song and dance of censorship of the graphics, now is not the time to back peddle on it.
    clear intention to copy another creator’s original work
    And who get's to make the call of there being clear intention? Random person reporting it? A person thinking someone else making the same thing is coping them? You? Will there be a chance given for the the accused to make their case? In clear cases were people are just submitting ripped templates this is great, but we already see issues happening with the moderation on the above. I want to know what's going to be done to keep it from being abused as well.

    Make the review process as transparent as possible, let us know the guidelines in which you will be having your support staff judge these things and not just telling us "UGC guidelines", or make them identical. Keeping us in the dark on what you tell your support staff just causes unnecessary issues when something does happen.

    And for the love of god include the user in the review process if at all possible, removing the UGC and punishing both the creator and the customers and then going "sorry" after the fact is asinine.
    mewberiDanDKArSkulderChernobyteVeremisiaBigBlackKappa
  • LouweLouwe
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 1,100
    Posts: 10
    Member
    This is really unfair... I feel like spending that much is ridiculous.
    With this, you guys will definitively kill the last remains of UGC in SA ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
    mewberimirta000CariseiMisoxShiruDanDKCurkyetriSherri
  • WAtheAnumWAtheAnum
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 1,285
    Posts: 50
    Member
    edited 2:37PM November 6, 2018
    "We provide shoppers with a better experience, focusing on high quality and more creative designs
    We protect the shop from content which explicitly violates the Terms of Service - especially sexually suggestive/obscene, copyright and trademark designs"

    and suddendly 80% of the design shop in EU goes missing.

    Im srs, i cant wait now till 8 nov and the "boom" in the design market. I just hope it will teach people a important lesion for their lifes.

    DONT SELL WHATS NOT YOURS.


    Also:
    for the meret part, i kinda have to agree with the most that 490 merets for each article placing in this said design market is a pretty high price, i can get 30 days premium for that to compare it with something worthly. 200-250 sounds pretty much legit and fair and there is still a risk to lose something.
    mewberiCariseiLouweSyrusMarufujiMintyliciousPizzaBearZatchDanDKRozelisaCurkyand 2 others.
  • BakaAnikiBakaAniki
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 4,610
    Posts: 157
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    That new listing fee... yikes.
    mirta000DanDKRozelisaCurkyNia
  • SyrusMarufujiSyrusMarufuji
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 3,395
    Posts: 202
    Member
    490 merets for each listing regardless of the price of the template is a little much. I feel like the listing fee should be a sliding scale based on the item you're listing. like 75 for gloves, 200 for dresses, etc. That way it won't kill the drive to create lower costing template items such as blocks or wall scrolls.

    490 merets to list one item feels like too much of a gamble for a majority of ugc creators. Just because we dont have hundreds of sales does not mean we don't create things of quality, just that we're being drowned out by the stolen garbage and get bumped out of view.

    MiaorangeJuice on the discord suggested you also offer listing vouchers as an rng drop from be fabulous dailies, so that you ugc creators just starting out can have the opportunity to list things on the ugc shop with a little more ease of mind.
    mirta000mewberiMisoxShiruRozelisaCurkyNiaTeSalveiZintack
  • SyrusMarufujiSyrusMarufuji
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 3,395
    Posts: 202
    Member
    edited 3:05PM November 6, 2018
    WAtheAnum wrote: »

    Im srs, i cant wait now till 8 nov and the "boom" in the design market. I just hope it will teach people a important lesion for their lifes.

    To be fair, I dont think we'll see a market boom until december 8th which is when all of the listings created before the update will have expired for those who can not justify the merets to relist their stuff.
    mirta000WAtheAnumDanDKVeremisiaZintack
  • WAtheAnumWAtheAnum
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 1,285
    Posts: 50
    Member
    WAtheAnum wrote: »

    Im srs, i cant wait now till 8 nov and the "boom" in the design market. I just hope it will teach people a important lesion for their lifes.

    To be fair, I dont think we'll see a market boom until december 8th which is when all of the listings created before the update will have expired for those who can not justify the merets to relist their stuff.

    agree here but still, we will see. I just cant wait now to see what will happen and "if it will happen".
    SyrusMarufuji
  • SyrusMarufujiSyrusMarufuji
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 3,395
    Posts: 202
    Member
    I think this change wont filter out all the memes and stolen stuff out completely but I am looking forward to seeing more original things and feeling better peace of mind when browsing ugc, instead of having one finger hovering over the report function for the 30th ahegao mask Ive seen that day.
    DanDKCarbonCoalChernobyte
  • mirta000mirta000
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 8,275
    Posts: 512
    Member
    I think this change wont filter out all the memes and stolen stuff out completely but I am looking forward to seeing more original things and feeling better peace of mind when browsing ugc, instead of having one finger hovering over the report function for the 30th ahegao mask Ive seen that day.

    If I did stolen UGC from Korea and original creator never reported me, I would now have hundreds of thousands of merrets to throw at UGC store when it becomes expensive. As some direct creators of item couldn't get rippers taken down after tickets being there for 20-40 days, this change is more detrimental to non rippers than to rippers.
    mewberiCariseiDanDKChernobyteVeremisiaZintack
  • LuminaEdgeLuminaEdge
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 8,435
    Posts: 361
    Member
    edited 3:34PM November 6, 2018
    Alright my main interest in this game has always been in the design shop. So my post will be strictly about it.

    Let me start by saying what i agree with.
    * increasing submission fees to deter spammers and those who post offensive content for the laugh.

    I know quite a few people that uploaded stolen art or talked about doing so. I agree that higher fees WILL lower the amount of spam/low effort or offensive content uploaded.

    *Improving the cut of the pay for each sale.

    Ya'll get the money either way. i see why trade taxes exist but since technically good content makers are making you guys REAL money in exchange for virtual points... you guys can always stand to be more generous. I've actually pulled out my card for some well done outfits.

    *Designs submitted in bad faith, with a clear intention to copy another creator’s original work or violate the ToS, will not be refunded, including both the listing fee and template cost (This will apply to the ad walls as well)

    Thank you, this irritated me so much. Complete lack of consequence was insane.

    *Review Team Training

    Very VERY much needed. Consistency has been extremely aggravating for the UGC community. We understand privacy is necessary. However in regards to stolen UGC designs, if the artist is the one filing the report. They don't need to know the extent to which the player was punished. I think its fair they get to be notified that the stolen work was removed. We can literally check anyway so might as well not treat your customers like complete idiots.

    Thank you guys SO much for finally giving dedicated attention to this issue.

    These ideas are DEFINITE improvements over the current state. HOWEVER. I still want to talk about issues in the current action plan and what can be done to improve things even further.

    *Submission Fee combined with change to listing time.

    I do agree with the choice to increase the listing fee. There's too much coming in to moderate, and making people spend a little bit more to participate is a decent, hands off fix for most of the problems. However the current proposal is kinda blind to a few realities of selling UGC in design shop.

    1. 490 flat for EVERY type of submission will discourage a LOT of content.
    If someone's paying 490 meret to post an item that sells for 400 meret apiece. Thats reasonable! Combined with the fee of making the ugc initially...It means they need to sell 3 pieces minimum to break even on their submission within 90 days. However, when you get to selling a house block or wall scroll that commonly sells for 100 meret... thats where the fee becomes a problem. An artist has to be confident that they can sell 590 meret worth minimum for uploading to be worth. Thats 8 sales.

    The less expensive a meret item sells for. The more cost-prohibitive it gets for an artist who's starting out. This can stifle creativity in the design shop. Not encourage it.

    Solution suggestion:

    I suggest changing listing fees to be proportional to the base cost of that template. Ideally within the range of 3-4 sales to break even.

    Alternatively.

    I think 90 days is too long of a period in the shop personally. Most people will see an item offered and made their choice within the first month or 2. Even my most recent UGC made most of its sales within the first 15 days before dropping off. This is partially due to the fact that if your outfit isn't a top seller, its gonna fall further back in the pages as time goes on. Losing visibility.

    Change the upload cost to 324 and the listing period of 60 days, Its long enough to still be more impactful, and still costly enough to deter spam. This pricing is based on day to meret ratio of your current proposal.

    2. If you're going to make listing and Re-listing this expensive. Relisting should rotate your outfit back to the first page so there can be more exposure. Unless your outfit is in a high spot of the total sales pages, relisting just means you're going to see less and less sales because players have to dig further back to find the outfit you put back up for another 30 days. Its a complete waste. So far the most popular works are in control of the Top Sellers page. There's not much advantage for latecoming UGC makers to rack up sales and Promoted items page gets clogged very quickly.

    3.Further suggestion. Increase the profit tax to 80%. I understand why you guys tax but I really think 80% is a good sweet spot to help UGC creators (especially ones starting up) be motivated in the face of these price hikes.

    There are people who don't have much expendable income who are very passionate about art. The ones i know have lost a lot of motivation to participate. There's also the issue of entry level ugc designers who have had okayish sales so far (Me.) Heavily debate reuploading my work now.

    Under these changes, it would cost 25$ to reupload my 5 best selling outfits, and they've all slowed down or stopped significantly on sales since they're no longer in the first 10 pages or so. I can't upload in confidence under these changes. I don't wanna lose the total sale by closing and relisting but it would be the only way to get visibility again.

    Please consider making further changes to smooth out the monetization for UGC. Thank you.





    SyrusMarufujimewberiCariseiPizzaBearMisoxShiruCurkyChernobyteNiaVeremisiaTamieand 1 other.
  • Unholy_RikuUnholy_Riku
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 485
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    Member
    Any chance we can improve the hit detection?
  • XnknownXnknown
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 765
    Posts: 56
    Member
    Thank you for the UGC changes. real designers can afford to pay 490 merets for an item that is high quality created and that will sell 10+ times.
    Can't complain about this, this will 100% clear up the effortless memes ugc and keep in the better designs. Thnx.
    VillainyHowlyeChernobyteYuforia
  • BakaAnikiBakaAniki
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    I feel like the only ones that will benefit the most from the increased listing fee are the best sellers and already established/popular creators since their sales are high enough to profit way past the break-even while there's lots of good quality content that don't even sell or struggle to make profit. This really discourages the newcomers and casual creators that actually make good content but don't bother to promote their stuff. But that's just my opinion.
    LouwemewberiMisoxShiruSkyborneDanDKmirta000ArSkulderCurkyKodaigaNiaand 4 others.
  • AskaLanglyAskaLangly
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 2,085
    Posts: 158
    Member
    SELLERS/BOTS
    Suggestion: Based on 3500 GEAR SCORE, than level.
    WallSeriesPoevezYuforiaLilehhh