Check out the patch notes for the v20 Lovely Update here: http://maplestory2.nexon.net/en/news/article/55909/lovely-update-v20

Petition to Remove Fair Fight

Comments

  • SnowdollsSnowdolls
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    edited 10:30AM October 12, 2018
    why i'm i being punished for being level 60 in the only end game content available? Please remove.
    Nimio
  • ACOACO
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    I don't know if what I'm about to say is true in practice, nor am I trying to defend Fair Fight, but in theory, Fair Fight should be balanced such that leveling up from 50 to 60 doesn't impact your DPS. That's the point of fair fight - to make sure that level 50s and 60s have comparable stats against a level 50 boss.

    ...

    Definitely agreed with what's being stated above. Fair Fight should NOT be removed but rather adjusted to work differently or properly.

    The complete removal of Fair Fight will negatively impact Maplestory 2 in the long run. If enacted, the removal would discourage party play, and establish a standard to solo rather than fostering interactions and cooperation amongst playerbase. One of the core development principles of Maplestory 2 is centered around community interactions and cooperation, and the removal of Fair Fight is a direct threat to the core design.

    With that said, there is a real need for the team to go back to the drawing board in regards to the implementation of the Fair Fight system - the concept is sound, but the execution is less than ideal. The fact that, given the same gear and skill point investment, a level 60 character does less damage than a level 50 character to the same boss in a particular dungeon is a major red flag and a huge concern. There is no doubt that the current Fair Fight scaling logic needs to be review.

    A potential suggestion, rather than applying a proportional negative adjustment given a character's level, is to implement a gear score ranges for dungeons - keep the minimum gear score requirement but place a ceiling to the gear score. This would also allows for a relatively simple future adjustment to the range as Maplestory 2 develops.
    To give an example, a level 50 dungeon gear score range could look something like this: 1500 - 1875 (25% increase to the base). Gear score above this range for this particular dungeon would have its benefits ignore. This allows more experienced players to observed the impact and the benefits of growth, still encourages party play, and will keep lower level contents relevant and challenging for new players. The percentage base adjustment of gearscore might need to be higher for harder content to encourage gear progression.

    Would love to hear more on what's being discussed internally for potential solutions from the team.
    DiaganoSyrusMarufuji
  • WooberWoober
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    edited 9:29PM October 12, 2018
    ACO wrote: »
    If enacted, the removal would discourage party play, and establish a standard to solo rather than fostering interactions and cooperation amongst playerbase.

    This argument is COMPLETELY FALSE and makes NO SENSE. NOBODY IS GOING TO WANT TO SOLO IF NEXON DISABLES FAIR FIGHT FOR 2 REASONS.

    1. It wastes a ton of time to solo, nobody is able to do the damage of 4 people with Fair Fight SOLO, it's going to promote party play because people want speed clears. Fair fight is literally just a time sink, plain and simple.
    2. The latest hard dungeons are IMPOSSIBLE to solo. Rune Temple, Lubelisk, and BeyondLink Tris cannot be cleared solo because
    they all have raid mechanics. Rune Temple needs all ads in each branching path to proceed to next stages, you CANNOT BACKTRACK. Lubelisk phase 2 requires 1 person on Each Echo or else they will spam Stuns, as well as 1 person aggro'd by Verrekant or else he'll spam full-heals on the echos. BeyondLink Tris is going to take AGES at the final phase because he will absorb you and you'll sit there for minutes on end.

    Seriously, your argument is SEVERELY flawed by the presence of the game's own content.
    SuperFunkWagon
  • SuperFunkWagonSuperFunkWagon
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    Woober wrote: »
    ACO wrote: »
    If enacted, the removal would discourage party play, and establish a standard to solo rather than fostering interactions and cooperation amongst playerbase.

    This argument is COMPLETELY FALSE

    I agree completely. Fair Fight is a big time sink that should not be in the game, in its current state.

    I do like the idea of a Gearscore cap -somewhat-, but I feel that it ruins the integrity of what Maplestory is. If you want dungeons to stay relevant at higher levels, what you could do instead of capping the gear is to release "Hard" versions of those dungeons, that give high level rewards but are much harder with enemies that hit harder, have much more hp, etc. It wouldn't take too many resources to do, since you aren't actually changing any of the dungeons, just increasing numbers. You can make sure the "Harder Dungeon" content stays updated to the current gearscore tier so that it always stays relevant.
  • Spiderbyt3sSpiderbyt3s
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    There is nothing fun about a boringly long dungeon becoming even longer. I have no urge to even run hard mode dungeons anymore. So then I play an alt, and remember it's just going to end up being the same thing. Playing and leveling up to become less powerful. Can someone honestly explain to me the benefit of fair fight? What amount of enjoyment am I supposed to get out of this system? Cause as it stands now, fair fight has sucked the fun out of this game for me already.
  • PsYDaniPsYDani
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    Ive already stated this during CBT2, fairfight makes my Knight do 5k damage rather than 15k damage per attack with the fairfight debuff on hard dungeons.
    Fairfight should not exist on Hard Dungeons only world bosses.
    Also, with the current fairfight system its impossible to clear Fire Dragon under 7 minutes which is the needed time to kill him to reach the best possible score on that dungeon.
  • ACOACO
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    edited 12:00AM October 13, 2018
    I want to try to address your points and the concerns you brought up.
    Woober wrote: »
    This argument is COMPLETELY FALSE and makes NO SENSE. NOBODY IS GOING TO WANT TO SOLO IF NEXON DISABLES FAIR FIGHT FOR 2 REASONS.

    Why go and party with other when I can just ask my high level friend or pay someone to just run me though the main story quest?

    Once Fair Fight is removed, players will no longer want to do lower level content because there is an alternative and a more efficient method to get through them. Simply request other players to run you through them either by asking or paying. Players will shy away from doing the actual content and opting for "shuttle service" as a mean to level faster. Not only will this completely disrupt the queue system for that particular dungeon, but it also makes the community less open and less interactive. This cannot be healthy for the game. Skipping content just to get to the end is a sure way to decrease a game's life expectancy.

    Woober wrote: »
    1. It wastes a ton of time to solo, nobody is able to do the damage of 4 people with Fair Fight SOLO, it's going to promote party play because people want speed clears. Fair fight is literally just a time sink, plain and simple.

    I'm unable to pictured four low level characters doing more damage than, say, a level 60 character with decent gear once Fair Fight is removed. Refer to my point above for clarification.
    Power creep will become a huge concern with real negative impact on Maplestory 2 later on if Fair Fight is removed.

    Again, my concern here is for most contents with the exception of end game. I will discuss this below.
    Woober wrote: »
    2. The latest hard dungeons are IMPOSSIBLE to solo. Rune Temple, Lubelisk, and BeyondLink Tris cannot be cleared solo because
    they all have raid mechanics. Rune Temple needs all ads in each branching path to proceed to next stages, you CANNOT BACKTRACK. Lubelisk phase 2 requires 1 person on Each Echo or else they will spam Stuns, as well as 1 person aggro'd by Verrekant or else he'll spam full-heals on the echos. BeyondLink Tris is going to take AGES at the final phase because he will absorb you and you'll sit there for minutes on end.
    Seriously, your argument is SEVERELY flawed by the presence of the game's own content.

    From reading and rereading your last point, it seems to me that the majority of your concerns are for late game contents.
    I'm actually not opposed to putting an extremely high gear score cap or even soft capping in end game contents - a complete removal at end game could also be considered. So on this point I believe we are on the same page - Fair Fight needs to be address for late game contents.
  • AynixAynix
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    Woober wrote: »
    Daily reminder that Fair Fight should be removed because it's an awfully unfun mechanic. SERIOUSLY, WHY IS FIRE DRAGON AND BALROG AFFECTED BY FAIR FIGHT?

    Because every dungeon in teh game is affected. WHy would Fire Dragon and Balrog be an exception?
  • SnowdollsSnowdolls
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    Aynix wrote: »
    Woober wrote: »
    Daily reminder that Fair Fight should be removed because it's an awfully unfun mechanic. SERIOUSLY, WHY IS FIRE DRAGON AND BALROG AFFECTED BY FAIR FIGHT?

    Because every dungeon in teh game is affected. WHy would Fire Dragon and Balrog be an exception?

    maybe because the current level cap is 60 whilst the only hardest content available is level 50 so everyone is getting heavy penalty for playing the game which make no sense.
  • KnookKnook
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    Please remove fair fight. It's really not enjoyable.
  • EternalxEternalx
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    edited 3:50AM October 13, 2018
    We said it would be a problem in CBT, they didn't listen. Now everyone is complaining ... still no answers.

    P.S: They said they would modify the numbers but that was no where in the patch notes lol.
  • SkengsSkengs
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    Gives no incentive to get stronger since le fair fight mechanic, Please just remove it I promise you no one will miss it.
  • AynixAynix
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    edited 4:38AM October 13, 2018
    Snowdolls wrote: »
    Aynix wrote: »
    Woober wrote: »
    Daily reminder that Fair Fight should be removed because it's an awfully unfun mechanic. SERIOUSLY, WHY IS FIRE DRAGON AND BALROG AFFECTED BY FAIR FIGHT?

    Because every dungeon in teh game is affected. WHy would Fire Dragon and Balrog be an exception?

    maybe because the current level cap is 60 whilst the only hardest content available is level 50 so everyone is getting heavy penalty for playing the game which make no sense.

    But Fire Dragon and Balrog are not the only "hard dungeons" in the game, why would only those 2 be ignored?
    Eternalx wrote: »
    We said it would be a problem in CBT, they didn't listen. Now everyone is complaining ... still no answers.

    P.S: They said they would modify the numbers but that was no where in the patch notes lol.

    I've never seen Nexon answering to people complains. Maybe they will patch it eventually (after couple months), but I doubt they will come to forum and say "hey, thats a good point, we will change it!"
  • ChaoticreduxChaoticredux
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    Please adjust fair fight so you don't do less damage then being lvl 50 , or remove it entirely. This is making me want to quit playing.
  • aleskidashaleskidash
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    Most people have already said what I've wanted to said, but yeah. Not feeling like you're actually progressing sucks.
  • loganologano
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    Please listen to the community, fair fight is draining my fun and many others. Pretty much every reason to remove it has been said (there's a lot), please read and reason with us. Thank you.
  • MS2IntroductionMS2Introduction
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    edited 7:14AM October 13, 2018
    Already commented on how dumb I think it is but also wanted to add that it screws you over for being lv60. You will do less damage at level 60 at FD than at lv50 assuming same gear because FF just straight up nerfs you. Pretty stupid that I'm doing LESS damage at lv60 with the exact same weapon than I did at 50. FF isn't making dungeons scale and be "fair", it's just a bloody nerf to your character (and seems to be a significant one) just for leveling lmao.

    I remember Nexon saying something about "you'll still be a bit stronger" a while back. Yeah, if I +13 my weapon of course I'm going to bloody stronger than I was at lv50 with a clean one. Straight up retarded, remove it from dungeons. Keep it for World boss if you have to.
  • VeggiVeggi
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    As the title stated above, Leveling to 60 is beyond punishing as Fair Fight is taking into action and is making dungeons alot longer than they are suppose to be as there is no content behind the 60 cap. If we are to remain in this cap for quite some time, as their roadmap has assumed, shouldn't there be something done about this fair fight thats set in play? Like its honestly killing the great vibe as it making going into dungeons seem "unfair" as my damage output is cut in half when another player who is weaker than myself will do more damage.
  • KasorasKasoras
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    Remove this disgusting feature or at least allow up to 3-4x dmg. Stop appealing to a small minority, the people that are actually heavily invested in this game don't like it.
  • KasorasKasoras
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    We need to start submitting support tickets, emailing, tweeting, etc. They clearly don't listen to feedback on the forums, ffs this poll has over 85% wanting it gone with hundreds of votes.