Check out the patch notes for the v17 Precursor Update here: http://maplestory2.nexon.net/en/news/article/53778/precursor-update-v17

"Forging Onwards" by Kyrios

CMKyriosCMKyrios
MapleStory 2 Rep: 3,295
Posts: 250
Administrator
edited 11:32AM August 22, 2019 in Team Blogs
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Dear Maplers,

Wow, it’s kind of weird to be the one writing the blog! Our team decided that with LAMBCOOK’s official departure from MapleStory 2, that I’d write a few blog posts until Producer Nimei returns to the office from her maternity leave in October.

This year has been a bit of a roller coaster so far, hasn’t it? We’ve had our high points and our low points, but for the most part I’m immensely proud of how far the game has come. If you ever get an opportunity to work in this kind of industry, I’m sure you’ll be surprised to see how deep the logistics go when it comes to localizing and developing unique features and systems for an existing game.

We’re approaching the final quarter of 2019, and with that, we’re also starting to approach the first year anniversary for MapleStory 2, as well as the next major expansion for the game, which will arrive before the end of this year!

Current Itinerary

I want to recap some of the previous livestream as well, and discuss why the next update will come in September. While we technically could deploy an August content update, it would be hard to guarantee appropriate time to fix any critical bugs that could potentially appear. This includes updating the Style Crate, which would require us to patch the game as well. Meret Market updates, on the other hand, can be done without requiring a new patch for the game, so we’ll have a few additions to the Meret Market. Some of you may have seen a certain Pink and Beany friend make an appearance on our social media. You'll see our adorable friend in your local Meret Market come August 29th along with the other additions! The best part? You’ll be able to buy the emote separately no strings attached, for a mere 300 Blue Merets! Another choice addition you’ll see to the Meret Market are the hotly requested Fox Ears, which have eluded players for the longest time.

pb-chair.png

Now, that all being said, the next update for MapleStory 2 will come in the middle of September rather than at the end of the month. In addition to our best in-game events and sales yet, it’ll come with a slew of bug fixes and a few noteworthy quality of life improvements.

We will still have anniversary and holiday events, and you’ll find a myriad of useful and fun rewards from them (including a few, choice, scrolls of interest...).

In the Meantime...

What of the month preceding, some of you may be wondering? You’ll have a few weeks between the end of August and the September update, and we are planning to run a few useful events for everyone. I won’t reveal all of them right now, but some of the ones we’ll be running include extending the 25% weekend enchanting discount, doubling drops in all level 60 Hard Adventure Dungeons (yes that includes Lapenshard fragments!), and discounting furnishing in your houses by 50%, all until the September update lands. These events will start near the end of this month.

In Closing

We have tried our best to keep you in the loop and be as transparent as possible with our proceedings, and we will continue to do so into the foreseeable future. We’re immensely thankful for our fans who continue to play and support the game, and hope that MapleStory 2 will continue to head in a good direction.

We’ll have more news to share as we come closer to September, so please stay tuned until then!

Faithfully your CM,
Kyrios

Comments

  • KellyyKellyy
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 510
    Posts: 3
    Member
    Anniversary Mushking Royale?
  • IllIIlIllIIl
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 3,145
    Posts: 479
    Member
    edited 11:22AM August 27, 2019
    CMKyrios wrote: »
    We have tried our best to keep you in the loop and be as transparent as possible with our proceedings, and we will continue to do so into the foreseeable future.

    That's actually not the case, you guys have been incredibly intransparent when it comes to key issues. You guys said that you don't want GMS2 to be a P2W game and you actually removed all the P2W stuff from the shop which is something I can give you credit for but why on earth are you guys so hesitant to do something about all the game mechanics which were originally designed to "force" players to buy these P2W items / are designed with P2W gear in mind? The clear count restrictions only exist so players would be incentivised to buy upgrade catalysts from the cash shop, with that gone why still keeping them? Most players hate them and they only cause further problems (e.g. altstory 2). The stat resistances on level 60+ bosses only exist because of some P2W mechanics which dont exist in this version of the game and yet you still decided to keep them because ???. There is pretty much no transparency here and the little tranceparacy that we get are based on slip ups which make the GMS2 team look like they don't know what they are doing, to give you an example:

    CMKyrios wrote: »
    hWuRDcx.png

    This right here is the most stupid s**t I've read in a long time and proves that they are either purposefully lying to the community or are completely incompetent, one of these 2 options has to be true (and we don't know which one cause lack of transparency but if I had to take a guess I'd say it's the former one because I just don't think they're that incompetent) because:

    - level 50 asc gear has the same upgrade costs as level 60 gear of the same "rarity" meaning upgrading level 60 leg gear is a lot cheaper than upgrading level 50 asc gear

    - in order to "faceroll" that raid hard enough that getting level 50 asc gear could be considered "too easy" you'd already need gear which is at least on par with the gear in question which would make getting it rather redundant

    - even if level 50 asc gear is as strong as level 60 leg gear you can't use it to progress towards level 60 asc gear because it doesn't have the required lapenshard resonances

    The whole notion that level 50 asc gear would "completely screw the equipment progression" is just nonsense for the same reason why no one bothers with level 50 leg gear anymore despite the fact that it's still about as powerful as the level 60 epic gear. It's just to cost ineffective without a single upside vs. the alternatives. This is obvious for everyone with at least half a working brain, now the story would be completely different if the ascended gear you acquire is scaled up to the level of the player in question (which is something I'd actually be in favor of) but this of course is not the case here which means that there is no point in "completely rebalancing the content" to take gear into consideration which would already make the rewards obsolete by default.

    Now personally I don't care about this stuff but if this is how they approach other topics (which they most certainly do) then this would explain a lot.
  • CMKyriosCMKyrios
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 3,295
    Posts: 250
    Administrator
    edited 3:17PM August 27, 2019
    IllIIl wrote: »
    ...

    You are always welcome to your opinion, even if it comes across as exceedingly aggressive!

    You cannot directly buy upgrade catalysts from the cash shop in other regions, outside of the occasional booster pack; those are very limited. There is a very strong reason why Chaos Onyx is lacking in the other regions' economy (and, if you were to ask those players why they play alts; it's for the Chaos Onyx specifically), whereas here Chaos Onyx supply is doing just fine, more than fine even. Even the Onyx Crystal market in GMS2 has settled drastically, and from our observed trends the improved event rewards have significantly helped with that, to which future event rewards will continue this trend.

    Stat resistances were ultimately seen as a system that didn't affect players enough to remove it completely by the team. No one complained about them during 60 Chaos progression (and when asked, players simply stated "because the raids were easy"), and only took real notice during Blackshard Nexus progression, which they ultimately were able to pass as well. We intend to keep the system as it is from the other regions, but they have mindfully removed the system altogether after receiving feedback from all relevant high end contents in the next tier.

    I know you have been a fierce advocate of removing run limitations. But I will tell you right now, the team will never remove run count limitations from Hard Adventure Dungeons or Chaos Raids, no matter how many times you ask. You can bring it up as many times as you want, but unfortunately it will never happen.

    The quoted block you posted also includes an inference from me from before I was staff and when I wondered the same thing; not an official answer, which I clarified in the first sentence. But even then, it's out of context, considering it was from a post where players were asking Chaos Balrog (a level 50 boss) to be added as a level 60 content rewarding Ascendant fragments, a rather abstract idea, but one that I was willing to provide an answer on regardless.

    Thank you for your valued feedback nonetheless as always, even if it comes across a bit direct at times!
    Xio_lenAnura_
  • IllIIlIllIIl
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 3,145
    Posts: 479
    Member
    edited 10:35AM August 28, 2019
    CMKyrios wrote: »
    You are always welcome to your opinion, even if it comes across as exceedingly aggressive!

    And why wouldn't I be? Nexon still refuses to tackle the core issues of the game with no explanation given as for why. I've seen multiple of my friends quit the game because you guys are not solving the issues and I'm not talking about the stuff that "takes time". Players bring up an issue and Nexon responds with "the team will never do X no matter how many times our players ask" and then when people finally shut up about it Nexon turns around and says stuff like "see no one complains about it so everything must be A-Okay", all this while still claiming stuff like "We have tried our best to keep you in the loop and be as transparent as possible with our proceedings". You know that this sentence would have also hold true if you can't be transparent at all which (looking at several issues) seems to be case for the most part.

    Also, I'd like to stress that every criticism I make no matter how harsh it sounds is primarily aimed towards the subject matter. I'm aware that employee X might feel diferent about a certain subject then employee Y but the decision the team as a whole (or whoever has the last word for that matter) makes is what affects players ingame. Personally I'd rather praise Nexon for how good they solved all these issues and play the game instead of making all these forum posts but I can't because the game is constantly telling me to f**k off until the next reset.


    CMKyrios wrote: »
    You cannot directly buy upgrade catalysts from the cash shop in other regions, outside of the occasional booster pack; those are very limited. There is a very strong reason why Chaos Onyx is lacking in the other regions' economy (and, if you were to ask those players why they play alts; it's for the Chaos Onyx specifically), whereas here Chaos Onyx supply is doing just fine, more than fine even. Even the Onyx Crystal market in GMS2 has settled drastically, and from our observed trends the improved event rewards have significantly helped with that, to which future event rewards will continue this trend.

    But the issue is far from solved. If you don't slack on your farming you have chaos onyx in abundance, notice how no one complains about that aside from stuff like people wanting more diversity in regards to what they can farm in order to obtain it? This is how it should have been for the other catalysts as well but nope, one character can't sustain their own needs which means that players are "forced" to play alts they can't stand while it's also used to justify the character bound on items (another thing players hate) which is punishing for those who actually like playing more than one character.

    More events are not going to solve the issue, it's just a band-aid solution and like others already said I'd rather see some event rewards which aren't stuff I should be able to get though normal gameplay.


    CMKyrios wrote: »
    No one complained about them during 60 Chaos progression (and when asked, players simply stated "because the raids were easy"), and only took real notice during Blackshard Nexus progression, which they ultimately were able to pass as well.

    This is a very dangerous way to look at things and you should abandon this line of thinking ASAP. There are generally 2 reasons as for why people don't complain about something: A: because there's nothing to complain about and B: because people have already given up hope and feel like there is no point in doing so anymore and let me tell you this: it's usually the later.

    Also, I've never seen you conduct a poll on these topics so I highly doubt that your sample size can be representative for the community as a whole. I've seen people complain about this in game but most people don't use stuff like the forums and those who do are generally not the casuals who make up for the majority of the playerbase which is why you see these kinds of complains more when it comes to end game content as these players are usually more outspoken when it comes to these issues but you're deluding yourself if you think that this is not an issue for the more casual players when it comes to the "lesser" content.



    CMKyrios wrote: »
    The quoted block you posted also includes an inference from me from before I was staff and when I wondered the same thing; not an official answer, which I clarified in the first sentence. But even then, it's out of context, considering it was from a post where players were asking Chaos Balrog (a level 50 boss) to be added as a level 60 content rewarding Ascendant fragments, a rather abstract idea, but one that I was willing to provide an answer on regardless.

    Irrelevant, in the part I quoted you were specifically talking about how level 50 asc gear (and not some upscaled level 60 stuff) would "completely screw the equipment progression" which makes absolutely no sense. All 3 level 60 chaos raids can be cleared with both level 50 leg and level 50 asc gear, everything after that requires level 60 leg / asc gear meaning that it ultimately wouldn't have made any difference as the gear progression would still be the same regardless. Even if it was just your guess it still reflects badly on the GMS2 team as it shows just how poorly their intentions are communicated to the player base and they would have to have a at least similar reason because the alternatives would be even worse but this brings us back to the actual main criticism of my previous post because this:

    CMKyrios wrote: »
    I know you have been a fierce advocate of removing run limitations. But I will tell you right now, the team will never remove run count limitations from Hard Adventure Dungeons or Chaos Raids, no matter how many times you ask. You can bring it up as many times as you want, but unfortunately it will never happen.

    Is a perfect example of what I was talking about: zero transparency. When they initially talked about the dungeon caps Nexon had this to say:

    NXACuddles wrote: »
    we wanted to reduce polarization between hardcore and casual players and promote party play between all types of players. We believe this system allows you to get gear/resources needed within a reasonable amount of time

    As time has proven it didn't "reduce polarization between hardcore and casual players" in fact it made it worse as the hardcore players just started farming over multiple chars / accounts which is something the more casual players are obviously not going to do. Nor did it promote "party play between all types of players", again the opposite is true. I've seen people getting kicked out of raid groups countless times for not having done some of their basic progression and the main thing that prevents people from finishing this stuff are the dungeon caps, which again are hurting new / struggling players and despite the fact that the clear count limits failed its initial goal, the enormous number of other problems it causes and how unpopular it is Nexon still vehemently refuses to get rid of them of course with no explanation given as for why so thx @Kyrios for proving my point once again.
  • SnickySnicky
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 530
    Posts: 15
    Member
    edited 6:28AM August 29, 2019
    That somne people get kicked out of parties u can't blame the GM's or anyone for . That is the attitude of high geared [ lvl ] players who just demand u have high + legend gear to even be able to take part of there party . Those people should just open up for others who ain't high + geared , we suppose to work alongside eachother [ some call it gettting caried ] , but some high lvl [ rich people ] in game ruin it for alot new ones or lower leveld / lower geared players . And what causing the outstream of players is also the new games brought on the , market where people move to . But there are still people around the less the amount might be . It is said by alot that the game is to much a grinding dungeons [ kinda true ] , hopefully they come back one day and make it also in a way that side quests make it more attractive to people where u can gain useable items off u need to make a progress in game . So not just the skyfortress quests only , I know they removed the dailyquests but hat was only connected to earn prestigechests in a different way then we do now .
    Anura_Flein
  • NovuhzNovuhz
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 1,425
    Posts: 107
    Member
    edited 1:05AM August 30, 2019
    IllIIl wrote: »
    CMKyrios wrote: »
    I know you have been a fierce advocate of removing run limitations. But I will tell you right now, the team will never remove run count limitations from Hard Adventure Dungeons or Chaos Raids, no matter how many times you ask. You can bring it up as many times as you want, but unfortunately it will never happen.

    Is a perfect example of what I was talking about: zero transparency. When they initially talked about the dungeon caps.

    Thank you for not removing limit cap because that would pretty much kill the game for many players.

    IllIIl wrote: »
    But the issue is far from solved. If you don't slack on your farming you have chaos onyx in abundance, notice how no one complains about that aside from stuff like people wanting more diversity in regards to what they can farm in order to obtain it? This is how it should have been for the other catalysts as well but nope, one character can't sustain their own needs which means that players are "forced" to play alts they can't stand while it's also used to justify the character bound on items (another thing players hate) which is punishing for those who actually like playing more than one character.

    More events are not going to solve the issue, it's just a band-aid solution and like others already said I'd rather see some event rewards which aren't stuff I should be able to get though normal gameplay.

    I don't really run alts for onyx crystal/chaos onyx and I'm doing just fine doing dungeons/raids on only my main. Not only that but I have 2 mains so I need resources for both characters yet I'm still doing fine. (They are both full ascendant gear)

    So the fact is one character can sustain their own needs.
    Anura_
  • Anura_Anura_
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 1,325
    Posts: 163
    Member
    edited 11:35PM August 30, 2019
    IllIIl wrote: »
    please read my wall of aggressive whiny bullshit and hate on everyone but myself
    I was planning to rebuke each one of your arguments (if they qualify to be called that) but you're just so full of shít that I just decided not to.
    Seriously, you must be living under the rock that you hit your head on if you think Nexon has "a lack of transparency".
    If you hate the game so much, why are you even here? It's evident you don't play the game anymore.

  • littledrummlittledrumm
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 100
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  • Xio_lenXio_len
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 315
    Posts: 9
    Member
    CMKyrios wrote: »
    IllIIl wrote: »
    ...

    You are always welcome to your opinion, even if it comes across as exceedingly aggressive!

    You cannot directly buy upgrade catalysts from the cash shop in other regions, outside of the occasional booster pack; those are very limited. There is a very strong reason why Chaos Onyx is lacking in the other regions' economy (and, if you were to ask those players why they play alts; it's for the Chaos Onyx specifically), whereas here Chaos Onyx supply is doing just fine, more than fine even. Even the Onyx Crystal market in GMS2 has settled drastically, and from our observed trends the improved event rewards have significantly helped with that, to which future event rewards will continue this trend.

    Stat resistances were ultimately seen as a system that didn't affect players enough to remove it completely by the team. No one complained about them during 60 Chaos progression (and when asked, players simply stated "because the raids were easy"), and only took real notice during Blackshard Nexus progression, which they ultimately were able to pass as well. We intend to keep the system as it is from the other regions, but they have mindfully removed the system altogether after receiving feedback from all relevant high end contents in the next tier.

    I know you have been a fierce advocate of removing run limitations. But I will tell you right now, the team will never remove run count limitations from Hard Adventure Dungeons or Chaos Raids, no matter how many times you ask. You can bring it up as many times as you want, but unfortunately it will never happen.

    The quoted block you posted also includes an inference from me from before I was staff and when I wondered the same thing; not an official answer, which I clarified in the first sentence. But even then, it's out of context, considering it was from a post where players were asking Chaos Balrog (a level 50 boss) to be added as a level 60 content rewarding Ascendant fragments, a rather abstract idea, but one that I was willing to provide an answer on regardless.

    Thank you for your valued feedback nonetheless as always, even if it comes across a bit direct at times!

    Compare to the CMS2 team, the GMS2 team have already done a very much better job to lead the game to the right direction and some changes made by the GMS2 team have also been implemented into CMS2 and KMS2. As a player also playing in CMS2, I would like to thank you and the team for the improved game content.
    Just one thing I would like to mention, In CMS2 the main issue for this version (the eye of lapenta version) is: even with great efforts, many new players joined at the beginning of this version still can't meet requirement to enter the final dungeon before the version ends (when level 80 version released) , because we have to up grade all three sets of legends to over +13 (in fact, the common requirement in CMS2 is +15 legends) and then start to level up the RGB lapentas for another several months with a chance to fail, this issure have been fixed by project new leaf in GMS2, but just beware that if the required progressing time for new players are too long, they may also lose their interest and motivation to catch up with old players and leave the game. In the current version in CMS2 (the level 80 version, Turka boss), old players don't need to run the legend dungeons due to they can already transfer their +15 to the new legend weapons on the first week, and have shown no interest on the 10 ppl asc dungeon drops (only asc assessors that not better than what people using) , many of CMS2 old players consider that the level 80 version have very little things to play with (so they off to play other games), but it does offer a chance for new player to catch up (so it looks like a issue for the balance between old and new players).
    Above are just some experience from my CMS2 play, hope those issues would't happen in GMS2.
    Anura_
  • Mat2Mat2
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 825
    Posts: 21
    Member
    Anura_ wrote: »
    IllIIl wrote: »
    please read my wall of aggressive whiny bullshit and hate on everyone but myself
    I was planning to rebuke each one of your arguments (if they qualify to be called that) but you're just so full of shít that I just decided not to.
    Seriously, you must be living under the rock that you hit your head on if you think Nexon has "a lack of transparency".
    If you hate the game so much, why are you even here? It's evident you don't play the game anymore.

    I think both sides had some pretty good points myself but I do think think "lack of transparency" isn't the complaint they're looking for. Sounds more to me like they meant the problem they have with what Kyrios said is "making vapid excuses to not fix things" but I don't know enough about the subject to have any real opinions on the matter myself.

    Also @IllIIl , word of advice: Don't shoot the messenger... PR people only say what they're allowed to say by their bosses, that's how their jobs work. Also their bosses might tell them what to say but I think that detail varies. Also in the future, try to properly collect your thoughts so you don't wind up using the wrong complaint again. You don't want to invoke GIGO when giving feedback, that never ends well.
    Anura_
  • MomokaaMomokaa
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 720
    Posts: 32
    Member
    edited 11:22AM November 3, 2019
    First off, you do a very poor job with resets and timers. For whatever reason whoever dictates these things do not have localized prime time in mind. Look at the last second change you made to bunny should really reflect that. NOW THAT WE SET THE CLOCKS BACK!!! the bunny and GGS is TOO EARLY IN THE DAY!!!!

    This game feels dead, it needs more people around. I need more crystal items to upgrade lapinsahrds, ether increase income or lower costs to reflect the activity we have to deal with. We do not have enough people killing word bosses anymore, interest in the game is really dying off and you have like 4 guilds running GDDS.

    REMOVE THE DEPENDENCE OF RNG to deal damage. Stop making pricing, boss damage, etc mean as much as it does. TRIVIALIZE THE GAINS LIKE MOST GAMES DO!!! (in other words those rng lines should mean little) AND HAVE DAMAGE MORE RELIANT ON MAIN STAT!!! so people can actually pass content in a fair time expectancy. The release of awakening was really bad at this, its like you expected players to have fully unlocked accessories and near perfect lines of level 50 accessories and capes. STOP CATERING TO THE HARD CORE!!! you keep doing that, and that is all you are going to have, a tiny user base. Also put main stat lines on ALL gear, it is ridiculous how much value the level 50 stuff had over the 60 stuff and what you had to go though to make the 60 stuff better. There is plenty of people that get turned off by grinds like this, and will not retain a large base from it. All you do with timers, making people run 10+ alts to fund one class is increase the gap of the rich and poor and the poor are the ones that end up quitting or semi quitting (stats to log in to just chat or hang in in queenstown, since you locked them out of content by making progression too grindy)

    GDDS is not fun with only 4 guilds do it!! and some small guild keeps being matched up on a guild that has double the players able play it 5 times in a row. Make it worth doing to the localized playerbase, do not assume what works in korea works here.

    I would also like the removal off ALL P2W aspects.
    Pay to win - a situation where the player can buy in-game content or in-game changes, with real money, that give the player a gameplay advantage or advance the player gameplaywise.
    You claim you do not have any pay to win stuff in this game when you do.
    The prime membership gives a discounts on enchaining, a cost you make ridiculous (cost here refers to the items to do the upgrading, i/e saving onyx in this case) You shouldn't have a need to cap 10 alts to keep up with the armor acquisition for one class. (in other words you expect a too fast pace with the gains you give us as far as onyx, expecting new players to need to run 20+ alts (since they are behind and need to catch up, needing mesos to buy things) is ridiculous, it is why you rarely see someone joining mid to late patch able to keep up and transition to the new one smoothly.
    remove p2w assistants, now that I know about this existing, I can speak out on it. having a monthly irl cost here is ridiculous
    removal of p2w trophy gains like instruments, there is a lot of instruments that is buy only, why?
    I am shocked there is a meme of a picture of kyrios saying there will not be no pay to win in this game ever, when pay to win always existed in some form. Just because it is lesser pay to win then what mainstream heavy effects get talked about does not absolve ms2 from claiming no pay to win exists.


    You need to learn to monetize though non-exploitative means. You need to make plans to do so without lootboxes as well. What are you going to do if laws are passed restricting the sale of loot boxes? They had talks that these things shouldn't be in games that looks like it is meant for children, and with the chibi art in MS2, it screams that. You really need to make monetization plans should such laws get enacted because of such laws are made and you are not prepare for it, this game will be hit hard. I do not want this game to die completely, that is why I am posting this. 65 dollars for 1 hairstyle if unlucky,... or like 120 dollars? for one outfit for one character is way overpriced. If you are going to price to whales, that is the only people are going to buy, and those numbers are few in number. Stop making the mass feel left behind, uncared for causing them to quit/ leave/ go in semi-MIA. We need a larger player base to get things done. Even the hard core players suffer when there is so few to play with, from the hardcore catering and focus.

    get off the 1 main class train of thought. I did not realize I disliked heavy gunner till it was way too late to change. I had t10 laps and such when I learned all the bugs and low DPS you refuse to fix. I do not understand why you insist of having such extreme time gating where when you want to change a class to focus on, it takes 2 months + to get it at the point the old class is. When you finally get it at that point, it makes you 2 months behind, or you are rushing to get caught up with the rest of the user base to be ready to preload the next expansion.
  • IllIIlIllIIl
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 3,145
    Posts: 479
    Member
    edited 10:42AM November 5, 2019
    Momokaa wrote: »
    We do not have enough people killing word bosses anymore

    And thats with a double drop event. Even the more popular World Bosses are "dead" unless a WB train is going on which isn't always the case.


    Momokaa wrote: »
    REMOVE THE DEPENDENCE OF RNG to deal damage. Stop making pricing, boss damage, etc mean as much as it does. TRIVIALIZE THE GAINS LIKE MOST GAMES DO!!! (in other words those rng lines should mean little) AND HAVE DAMAGE MORE RELIANT ON MAIN STAT!!! so people can actually pass content in a fair time expectancy.

    I don't think the impact the bonus attribute system has on character performance is problematic, at least not by default. They just need to remove the dependency on RNG by making the bonus attribute rolls of armor / accessories non weighted, allow enchant transfer to gear of the same level, type, and rarity and buff the useless attributes like recovery bonus and skill cooldown reduction to make them a viable alternative to the ones that only increase your damage numbers.

    If done right the bonus attribute system could have been a usfull tool to further customize your character which wouldn't be possible if you trivialize them.


    Momokaa wrote: »
    STOP CATERING TO THE HARD CORE!!!

    I have to disagree here, they're not actually catering to the hardcore part of the playerbase. Many hardcore players don't like building up their character just to be told by the game to use different one after reaching the dungeon cap. Many hardcore players want difficult content but instead of getting a difficult trophy raid which is balanced around BIS gear we got a challenging one (at best) that hands out BIS gear, trivialising the difficulty in the process. Many hardcore players don't want to run a "one man show" when they join a random pug raid. Someone who completely finished his standard non trophy progression would end up with exactly 46082 GS which (knowing Nexon) still won't be enough to enter the Chaos Infernog raid despite the fact that this char is actually already significantly stronger than a new payer with level 70 +15 epic gear is going to be.

    Now they actually do seem to cater to a bubble but both casual and hardcore players are getting screwed here.


    Momokaa wrote: »
    get off the 1 main class train of thought. I did not realize I disliked heavy gunner till it was way too late to change. I had t10 laps and such when I learned all the bugs and low DPS you refuse to fix. I do not understand why you insist of having such extreme time gating where when you want to change a class to focus on, it takes 2 months + to get it at the point the old class is.

    It's actually amazing how much damage the caps are able to cause to this game, without event it takes ~250 runs (~2 months) to get a lapenshard to +10. Once you finish upgrading 3 of them it's almost time for the new update which isn't just going to make most of them irrelevant due to power creep, nope they have to go one step further and decrease their level by 3 (iirc) for no reason other than adding insult to injury. But yeah, switching classes or gearing up your alts is not really an option for the average player, most players don't even have enough spare resources to upgrade their armor which tells you everything you need to know.
  • MomokaaMomokaa
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 720
    Posts: 32
    Member
    edited 10:46PM November 6, 2019
    Ty for addressing the time zone thing on stream. I just wanted come here to tell others that you personalty replied to it and going to bring it up to them. The time zone thing to me is hurting the game the most. When we set back to standard time, the reset is simply too early and can cause us to miss a day completely. (because of the awkward timing it is easy to forget) Like I tried to get across, this pushes stuff like GDDS 1 hr earlier, and currently on my server it is pretty slow in the first hour to begin with. So if the trend is the same, now its going to be slow for the full 2 hours since the second active hour is now pushed out completely.

    Ty also for the instrument comment, trying to cut back on paywalls like that is a blessing.

    IllIIl is right about the not caring to the hard core as far as skill level, I meant hard core as in hard core grinding, since that seems the focus of the game, busy work so no one can fully gear up by next patch cycle. This causes a few problems. First of all if a hard core grinder knows they can't mathematically max .. say a lapinsahard because of time gate, they may not bother at all and just let the update start over. (This is the current situation, I know a lot of top end players simply MIA or quit completely, see the few high profile guilds that died in the last two months. Some current are also on the verge of collapse) This means they are not playing, or least much less of them, to help out others, and we get the current situation of the game feeling dead.

    So there needs some kind of balance, giving something the hard core grinders to strive for, while still allowing enough free time to do other things, like gather helper coins, do trophies and other things. Like the fair fight cpap thing. It is a GREAT IDEA in concept, but you said something like needing to do 9 a week for all rewards? that is too much of a time sink, and leads to a opportunity cost problems with available play time. When I use terms as hard core and casual, I am STRICTLY speaking about play time per day availability. You can be high skilled but a casual, you can be low skilled but a hard core grinder. I think it is very important to keep such concepts in mind when trying to appeal to different types of people. You really need to appeal to these different types so you have a higher playerbase so people can do things.

    So now you have value in doing the old c raids (because you get more and easier chances for better stat lines) the fortress rumbles, the 3 current 60 craids (or least 1-1-1 S+ and the rest normals depending on your progress) farming 10 coins, running alts to fund raising gear/ buying good stat lines, RBGS, BSN, then you add in this cpap thing? 9 rungs a week? the airships for cfrags? I am personally not established from the original expansion, I am never going to get highest rank for airship and such for pet and other things I would like to do because I spend too much time doing what I listed here, I simply run out of time to do anything else in the week, and i nearly play this game 24/7. I feel SO BAD for casuals that have limited time, and I see them all the time, they are stuck in epic gear, or maybe access 1 rbg, it is hard for them to feel progress and stay interested in the game. In fact, just today I ran into someone that said he could only play 2 times a week when it is late in the week, and because of this, less people are playing and hard for him to get runs, hard dungeon runs mind you, he simply did not play for 5 months. I do not have all the solutions here but I can point out problems in a slippery slope concept of population. If it gets too small, people are not going to be able do things and just gets smaller because the population is small..... something needs to be done to retain interest throughout the week and your idea on having event on Monday -wensdsay may help curb this and may get ideas from such an experiment to see if you can try keep a more steady population throughout the week.

    I can give an idea for this, take FFXI, or least the first 7? years of it before went easy mode. For endgame you had valuable open world bosses to hunt, that you can do every day (picture bunny being able to give a reroller or something, but you can only get 1 drop a day) then you would have a "craid" that was time locked of being able go to it once a day, then you had this other place where you could enter it every 3 days. So because of the different staggering people could do, you had a little something to do each day.... not just oh cap 30-30, then 3-3-3 in the first 2-4 days then > dead....

    Also I would really like the freedom to play more then one class, and for others because a lot of people I know do attempt it. I just got a second bsn character and know others that done the same. But I was able do this so late in the cycle and its hard for me to level the lapinsahrds on the second because I can't find enough world boss activity now. i cant fund her strictly off the holloween event, and I do my best to take out like 9-20 per day (the first hour is a lot more giving due to people not aware of the time issue/ can't get on because too early)
    If done right the bonus attribute system could have been a usfull tool to further customize your character which wouldn't be possible if you trivialize them.
    this is a nice idea in theory, but how many games you seen able to pull it off? I have not experienced any. What happens is, and MS2 is the same thing, is this "customization" ends up being an illusion of choice and everyone flocks to "BiS" However, least in those other games, at least as far as stats go, because they are trivialized, at least you are not kicked for too low dps because you can't clear it. There is simply too much a dependency of rng results in these lines to have enough dps to clear them. Early on, it was VERY common to see people kicked out of hard dungeons/ craids/ rbgs because of lacking gems and lines cause them to do too little damage. In a pug, stuff like this:
    https://gyazo.com/1e6f2aa1777f9f80ccd15cdb73ef1a9f
    is way too common. this gap needs to be smaller.
    Novuhz wrote: »

    I don't really run alts for onyx crystal/chaos onyx and I'm doing just fine doing dungeons/raids on only my main. Not only that but I have 2 mains so I need resources for both characters yet I'm still doing fine. (They are both full ascendant gear)

    So the fact is one character can sustain their own needs.

    not mathematically possible unless
    1. you are insanely lucky
    and or
    2. you have transfer scrolls / crystal ore to make use of. (likely on both chrs)

    I have to tell you coming to awaking without any past embellishment, 10 alts could not fund 1 character. I opened a secondary account to fund progression. I got a second chr to bsn only because, those other 9? characters run airship weeklies so I can easily move the gear around for all the alts to upgrade the asc gear to give it to the second character, ALONG with gems. if I was not able to do this, level and enhance so much on alts.. if I did not run alts, i would still be stuck on one class. ALSO if I did not run alts at all, because of no establishment before the release of awakening, I am not even sure my one character would be able bsn, .. maybe? least not as long as i have been doing it. Also I would have zero mesos, while doing so.
  • IllIIlIllIIl
    MapleStory 2 Rep: 3,145
    Posts: 479
    Member
    Momokaa wrote: »
    I meant hard core as in hard core grinding

    The game doesn't cater to them either, quite the opposite. Why do you think everything is character bound? According to CMKyrios on reddit it's about not giving players with multiple chars to much of an advantage. The dungeon caps (and caps in general) are another big problem for these people for obvious reasons. I mean they can (and will) use ways to circumvent the caps but it's still annoying.

    Also, cracking down on the grinders is really not a smart thing to do. Just think about it, what are they trying to accomplish here? Preventing people from getting to far ahead? That's going to be the case regardless, if anything it just makes it harder for the rest of the player base to catch up which leads to gigantic gaps in character performance. Letting grinders grind the content would at least mean that you could reliably find some parties / players to play the content with which is something the casuals would profit from immensely.

    Unlike with the level 50 stuff even that late in the current content the average pug still needs people to hard carry. This was not the case with Balrog back then were pretty much everyone was at +15 epic and pugs were able to clear him in ~1 min. But who do you think is doing to carry the pug raids? The more elitist players only play amongst themselves and the average casual still can't carry their own weight.There are also those with decent gear willing to help out but they are way to few for them to be a solution to the problem. Having those hardcore grinders is a good thing for the game and nothing of value can be accomplished by cracking down on them which is something the responsible decision makers at Nexon still vehemently refuse to understand.


    Momokaa wrote: »
    giving something the hard core grinders to strive for

    There already is something for them "to strive for": the unique dungeon specific rare item drops like the shadow mantle. The drop chance is low enough (like <1%) and some of them need multiple copies. It's also not part of your basic character progression so it doesn't really affect anyone else. The problem here are the caps cause you can't efficiently grind the content if the game tells you to "come again next week" after 6 runs.


    Momokaa wrote: »
    this is a nice idea in theory, but how many games you seen able to pull it off?

    How many games do you know have actually tried to pull it of? This is one problem I have with RPGs in general. Most western RPGs keep the special effects on gear as low as possible rendering them effectively useless. Most asian RPGs on the other hand are almost the polar opposite: bonus attributes are extremely impactful but are generally just 50 different versions of "bigger numbers" imbedded in some RNG infested P2W system.

    But we do know that people take utility over DPS if given a meaningful choice (e.g. No Quarter vs. Invigorating Precision in GW2). I'd guarantee you that people would actually use Nutaman's Earrings over other more offensive options if the effect was "recover 5% of your maximum HP on hit" instead of "chance to recover 20% of your maximum HP on hit with a 30? sec. ICD" and the same goes for bonus attributes.