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Why be like a Ranger?...

AyavuuAyavuu
Maplestory 2 Rep: 300
Posts: 7
Member
edited 7:23AM November 27, 2018 in Heavy Gunner
Somewhat of a rant but I see a potential discussion about this.

[Some background]
So far, of all the discussions about highest dps builds I've read is largely between Bullet Spray and Charge Kit.
And the problem I have with this is that if I'm building my character and fighting style around these two, I might as well go play Ranger because they are the true turret mode class.

When I do chaos runs, I really enjoy being competitive in the DPS meter, but realize the pros and cons with a lot of classes doing so much better.
How Rangers and HGs don't have to run around in a circle to dodge the laser when there's no Knight's shield,
or how Berserkers don't have to stop dps while dodging since they can move spinning,
or how efficiently Runebladers can kill adds with Knights,
ect.
ect.

And these little advantages give you timing windows where you can catch up in dps.
Moments to shine while other classes can't and vice versa.

[My Point]
But HG right now.
HG is just a worse Ranger if I'm focused on turret moding.
EDIT : HG FEELS like a worse ranger at turret moding

IMO the advantage HG has over Ranger is his ability to be doing damage while dodging and doing bursts of damage at a time.
Suborbital bombardment, Rocket Launcher, Magnet Bomb, these things do dps while you aren't attacking, like a better version of thief poison.
So I can keep up dps while I have to dodge..
or if I have to stop dps to dodge, I can throw out some quick bursts with M.Bomb or homing missiles to do the same amount of damage I would have if I were able to stand still and keep bullet spraying for the next few seconds.

These are some of the advantages HG has over Ranger,
but to my knowledge so far, specing too many points into these things lower over all dps and you're better off turret moding with bullet spray or charge kit... and it makes me : (

I'm still trying to learn and figure out builds or fighting styles that will let me compete with Rangers of similar gear in DPS.
I'd like to know if anyone agrees or disagrees with me!

Edit 2 : Formatting

Comments

  • AlchemiiAlchemii
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 1,190
    Posts: 53
    Member
    edited 1:08PM November 26, 2018
    Ok, I wasn't going to comment on this because there is no potential discussion here, but I am worried new players might see your post and think your right. Your just wrong. First off, Ranger does not Out DPS a HG. HG fights for the top spot of DPS with Assassin. So there is no arguing this, the only reason people even bring Ranger to CDev is for that accuracy bonus.

    Going into this more, you seem to completely misunderstand how HG works. We are not a mobile turret, we are THE mobile turret. HG builds, and thus damage, are built around a single core skill of solid damage. You get a choice on what that skill is, and it will affect the rest of the build, but your choices are either Bullet Spray or Rapid-fire Electric Blast. You build around one those two. Lock-on, Magnetic Bomb, Rocket Launcher, Homing Missiles, and Suborbital bombardment are just extra skills to be sprinkled in, but they do not make up the majority of your damage.

    Now notice I didn't mention M-bomb. That is because M-bomb is garbage. It's only use is to quickly hit enemies that are on a higher platform than you and your party. It is the lowest DPS skill you have access too, and should never ever be used outside of of the above situation, because it will always be a loss in damage. And how dare you compare Homing Missiles to M-bomb, Homing Missiles are actually useful. Specially since Homing Missile can do what M-bomb does, but with some rng, and way out DPS M-bomb.

    I have a Heavy Gunner Damage Calculations thread, where I break down the dps of each skill (except 2), talk about my thoughts on the less straight forward skills and their uses, break down stat choices, and give 2 viable example builds.

    And Lanbobyonson did a video guide on how to deal with healing adds CDEV Heavy Gunner Guide. He left out the M-bomb strat which is easier to pull off, but honestly if you can reliable do it with Homing Missiles, then you can take that one point out of there and put it somewhere useful.


    TL;DR: No Potentional Discussion here.
    SuweekaHyarchy
  • AyavuuAyavuu
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 300
    Posts: 7
    Member
    edited 7:20AM November 27, 2018
    Just to make sure I understand what you're saying.
    Are you saying that Heavy Gunners out DPS Archers at turret moding (Standing still and "Basic attacking" vs using abilities)?
    Or maybe that Heavy Gunners do indeed compete in dps with out turret moding?

    I'm arguing that I don't like the feeling of having to turret mode and enjoy using dots and bursts because I believe the Ranger is designed more specifically to turret having so many abilities that support their version of bullet spray (arrow stream/rapid shot) while we have only 1 that supports ours (Advanced bullets).

    EDIT:
    Alchemii wrote: »
    Your just wrong. First off, Ranger does not Out DPS a HG.
    I'd like to point out my reply to Hyarchy,
    I realized while replying to him you missed my point.

    You're stating that HGs do indeed out dps and that I just lack the knowledge.
    But I'm not talking about who out dpses who, I'm talking about how they dps.

  • HyarchyHyarchy
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 500
    Posts: 16
    Member
    How can you say something is better or worse when your knowledge isn't even near what you need to know to say these kind of things? It's mostly speculations, maybe's and i thinks.
  • AyavuuAyavuu
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 300
    Posts: 7
    Member
    Hyarchy wrote: »
    How can you say something is better or worse when your knowledge isn't even near what you need to know to say these kind of things? It's mostly speculations, maybe's and i thinks.

    You're right, I edited it from "HG is a worse ranger" to "HG feels like a worse ranger".
    But keyword there is, *at turret moding*

    I'll agree that it is my speculation, I don't see a lot of stats/calculations for Ranger DPS or comparisons between the two. From what I can tell, people in THIS thread saying HG out dpses rangers is also speculation.

    Not to mention, I'm not talking about who out dpses who, I'm talking about how they dps.
    Like Alchemii said, right now HG's main dps is Bullet Spray or Rapid-Fire Electric Cannon, and everything else being sprinkled on damage.
    IN MY OPINION, it should be the other way around, dots and bursts being main dps with bullet spray or rapid fire being the the sprinkle while things are off cooldown. That is the main point I'm trying to get at, not whether or not it is.
  • VinxinusVinxinus
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 690
    Posts: 28
    Member
    Ayavuu wrote: »
    Hyarchy wrote: »
    How can you say something is better or worse when your knowledge isn't even near what you need to know to say these kind of things? It's mostly speculations, maybe's and i thinks.

    You're right, I edited it from "HG is a worse ranger" to "HG feels like a worse ranger".
    But keyword there is, *at turret moding*

    I'll agree that it is my speculation, I don't see a lot of stats/calculations for Ranger DPS or comparisons between the two. From what I can tell, people in THIS thread saying HG out dpses rangers is also speculation.

    Not to mention, I'm not talking about who out dpses who, I'm talking about how they dps.
    Like Alchemii said, right now HG's main dps is Bullet Spray or Rapid-Fire Electric Cannon, and everything else being sprinkled on damage.
    IN MY OPINION, it should be the other way around, dots and bursts being main dps with bullet spray or rapid fire being the the sprinkle while things are off cooldown. That is the main point I'm trying to get at, not whether or not it is.

    So then, what's the whole point of this thread? You essentially made something that only says 'yo, these two classes play differently', a statement you can apply to almost everything. Just to be sure that you clarified it, because so far, I don't see it.
  • AyavuuAyavuu
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 300
    Posts: 7
    Member
    Alchemii wrote: »
    You essentially made something that only says 'yo, these two classes play differently', a statement you can apply to almost everything. Just to be sure that you clarified it, because so far, I don't see it.

    Ok, I mean to say, they SHOULD play differently.
    Clearly archers are better designed for turret moding and Heavy Gunners are more designed for burst and dots.
    However the optimal style of dps as Heavy Gunner is to turret mode.
    Which leaves the bad taste in my mouth since I enjoy the gunner, but when I have to compete in dps I have to play like a ranger.
  • VinxinusVinxinus
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 690
    Posts: 28
    Member
    Ayavuu wrote: »
    Alchemii wrote: »
    You essentially made something that only says 'yo, these two classes play differently', a statement you can apply to almost everything. Just to be sure that you clarified it, because so far, I don't see it.

    Ok, I mean to say, they SHOULD play differently.
    Clearly archers are better designed for turret moding and Heavy Gunners are more designed for burst and dots.
    However the optimal style of dps as Heavy Gunner is to turret mode.
    Which leaves the bad taste in my mouth since I enjoy the gunner, but when I have to compete in dps I have to play like a ranger.

    Ah I see your point now. Unfortunately, when it comes to game design, characters/classes that were intended for a purpose ends up being better at something else and not as good as what they were supposed to be. That's just how it is and I don't see it changing anytime soon.