Please do not send inquiries to the Forum Moderators and Community Manager Cuddles regarding forum name changes. Exceptions are only made if the forum name violates the CoC. Thank you for understanding.

Which Epic Weapon to Enchant?

UrgiUrgi
Maplestory 2 Rep: 1,115
Posts: 18
Member
in Thief
Sorry if this is a stupid question, but I basically have a pair of every epic dagger except the MSL Onyx Dagger, but I don't know which weapon I should enchant and which weapon would be most beneficial to me a long term.

So, which daggers should I enchant?
  1. Which Dagger?37 votes
    1. Murpagoth
       30% (11 votes)
    2. Springer's
       22% (8 votes)
    3. Ancient Rune
       24% (9 votes)
    4. Get MSL
       24% (9 votes)

Comments

  • SentineIsSentineIs
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 1,605
    Posts: 157
    Member
    Now that all 3 weapons work in all the raids it is a question of effect and availability. Both Murpa and MSL have a good effect, with Rune being a bit more class specific. However, Murpa outshines the other two due to availability and accessibility. Fire Dragon is one of the most run, and most beginner friendly dungeons in the entire game, you don't need a priest, or a knight, or any specific class to run it. Whereas Barlog would be cancerous with a knight and a priest, and Tris without a priest, fire dragon is easy to do, quick even with beginners and popular.

    So Murpa is the best to hit +15 with. You will get weapons a lot easier so long as you don't have a dedicated group for Tris or Lubelisk.
  • EcchiOtakuTMEcchiOtakuTM
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 1,430
    Posts: 158
    Member
    edited 1:58AM November 6, 2018
    Personally I prefer msl because a boss might run while murpagoth buff is up since thief can't always unload for those 10 seconds in that time. Murpa are better for burst type builds though since they don't mind down time as much as sustain damage builds.

    But it doesn't really matter between the two. One has a better burst potential but might suffer if a boss leaves during that time while one is more consistent but just does half for 2x duration.

    Although if someone actually tested and put the downtimes between the two could help in choosing better.

    Ancient rune are fun as hell but didn't come close to the other two in actual use for me. While springer's just don't come anywhere close to any of the 2 in terms of boost and it can't have stats on it like the other 3 (22% vs 18%/9% which jump to 72%/36% which even without the quad effect still have double penetration on them and far more easily upgradeable albeit thief's 1500 daggers are cheap for now)

    That being said once weapons start hitting 13+ it really doesn't matter much just preference, but I would suggest msl basically but murpagoth if you're rotating closer to a burst build.

    Edit: I wouldn't choose a weapon based off being able to get runs since they're limited per day/week anyways. Running FD constantly doesn't drop anything of sellable value while lube, beyond and even rune drop 4 highly demanded items. MSL is in two of these
  • LastTourniquetLastTourniquet
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 1,185
    Posts: 93
    Member
    I prefer Rune Dagger for thief because more attack speed means more spirit and more cunning procs. More Spirit and Cunning procs means I get to do more stuff. Doing more stuff means I feel more engaged in the game. Being more engaged in the game is fun.
    VendalDerpinator
  • King_KupoKing_Kupo
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 200
    Posts: 2
    Member
    edited 5:32PM December 5, 2018
    Apologies for bumping a thread that’s a month old but I can’t seem to find another post that addresses my questions exclusively...

    I currently have a thief and am running FD like no other to get good stats on a set of daggers but I tend to see a lot of thieves running Ancient Rune daggers... I understand that the main reason for this is the attack speed buff; more AS = more cunning procs = more opportunity to use skills that are enhanced by cunning.

    So I guess i have three questions here...
    1. Wouldn’t the “DPS drop” from running ancient rune instead of murpagoth be negligible since the AS buff allows you to use more enhanced abilities?

    2. If the damage is NOT negligible and it is a big difference in DPS...
    Is the fun of ancient rune worth the drop in DPS from not running Murpagoth?

    3. Lastly, is MSL also a viable option in both DPS and fun playability?
  • WallSeriesWallSeries
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 1,460
    Posts: 244
    Member
    edited 11:51PM December 5, 2018
    King_Kupo wrote: »
    Apologies for bumping a thread that’s a month old but I can’t seem to find another post that addresses my questions exclusively...

    I currently have a thief and am running FD like no other to get good stats on a set of daggers but I tend to see a lot of thieves running Ancient Rune daggers... I understand that the main reason for this is the attack speed buff; more AS = more cunning procs = more opportunity to use skills that are enhanced by cunning.

    So I guess i have three questions here...
    1. Wouldn’t the “DPS drop” from running ancient rune instead of murpagoth be negligible since the AS buff allows you to use more enhanced abilities?

    2. If the damage is NOT negligible and it is a big difference in DPS...
    Is the fun of ancient rune worth the drop in DPS from not running Murpagoth?

    3. Lastly, is MSL also a viable option in both DPS and fun playability?
    since ur thief, having faster spirit recovery mean more dps....
    for 1 and 2, its safe to say that 1% melee = 1% attack speed
    lets say u have 50% dmg or 50% speed
    if every clap is 100s, 4 spirits per hit
    u get 150s a hit, 1 hit per second, 2 seconds = 300s, 8 spirits
    u get 100s a hit, 1.5 hit per second, 2 seconds = 300s, 12 spirits
    in short term, having % melee is better
    in long term, having % speed is better
    since u know, u don’t usually have 150% attack speed... so u dont get the bonus value out of attack speed as fast as u get from % melee

    Murp/MSL are good for Posion or VC build
    Rune is good for VC build

    assume the proc for all 3 weapons are the same....lets say it proc a few seconds after the effect ends and they dont proc if the effect is taking place
    wouldnt Murp/Rune proc pretty often with their short duration and high bonus value?
    if it procs so often, why use something like MSL that give low bonus value and long duration?
    MSL is good if the proc chance is extremely low, but it seems to proc very often to me...

    Murp/MSL are good if ur on posion and have kandura’s necklace
    Rune is will get u killed faster with kandura’s necklace in VC build.... cost hp per hit.....
    Murp is a best option for most build, but MSL might be better depending on how u proc SA.... Haste is also a problem that might afftect ur dps in many way....
  • King_KupoKing_Kupo
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 200
    Posts: 2
    Member
    WallSeries wrote: »
    King_Kupo wrote: »
    Apologies for bumping a thread that’s a month old but I can’t seem to find another post that addresses my questions exclusively...

    I currently have a thief and am running FD like no other to get good stats on a set of daggers but I tend to see a lot of thieves running Ancient Rune daggers... I understand that the main reason for this is the attack speed buff; more AS = more cunning procs = more opportunity to use skills that are enhanced by cunning.

    So I guess i have three questions here...
    1. Wouldn’t the “DPS drop” from running ancient rune instead of murpagoth be negligible since the AS buff allows you to use more enhanced abilities?

    2. If the damage is NOT negligible and it is a big difference in DPS...
    Is the fun of ancient rune worth the drop in DPS from not running Murpagoth?

    3. Lastly, is MSL also a viable option in both DPS and fun playability?
    since ur thief, having faster spirit recovery mean more dps....
    for 1 and 2, its safe to say that 1% melee = 1% attack speed
    lets say u have 50% dmg or 50% speed
    if every clap is 100s, 4 spirits per hit
    u get 150s a hit, 1 hit per second, 2 seconds = 300s, 8 spirits
    u get 100s a hit, 1.5 hit per second, 2 seconds = 300s, 12 spirits
    in short term, having % melee is better
    in long term, having % speed is better
    since u know, u don’t usually have 150% attack speed... so u dont get the bonus value out of attack speed as fast as u get from % melee

    Murp/MSL are good for Posion or VC build
    Rune is good for VC build

    assume the proc for all 3 weapons are the same....lets say it proc a few seconds after the effect ends and they dont proc if the effect is taking place
    wouldnt Murp/Rune proc pretty often with their short duration and high bonus value?
    if it procs so often, why use something like MSL that give low bonus value and long duration?
    MSL is good if the proc chance is extremely low, but it seems to proc very often to me...

    Murp/MSL are good if ur on posion and have kandura’s necklace
    Rune is will get u killed faster with kandura’s necklace in VC build.... cost hp per hit.....
    Murp is a best option for most build, but MSL might be better depending on how u proc SA.... Haste is also a problem that might afftect ur dps in many way....

    I see. I can see why it makes sense that in the short term the damage stat would matter more than attack speed.

    Then to reiterate one of the questions I had...

    HOW much of a difference does the DPS between Murpa and Rune make?
    If we’re talking in terms of short time and long time, let’s say we hit the dummy for 10 minutes how big is that difference?

    I don’t need actual numbers if someone’s already tested this, I would simply like an answer.

    And what about Leki’s build? The hybrid poison AND VC build? Which weapon is good for that build?
  • UinixUinix
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 900
    Posts: 100
    Member
    edited 6:35AM December 6, 2018
    Attack speed falls off starting at past 8% interms of damage vs msl springer and murpa. Springer is the best if you can afford it, since it has a higher uptime as well as higher damage buffs (they stack according to some players who use them. By this I mean 1 wep would give 11% and two would give 22%) and lower cd than msl and murpa, albeit it doesn't give pierce/ppierce, which you have to make up using accessories. Even so, springer would have higher damage output since you will have the buffs up longer.

    MSL is better in most cases vs murpa since it has higher uptime. Both msl and murpa has around a 25s or 30s downtime (I don't really remember), but since msl is half the damage buff and double the time that it is up, you can see slight damage increases.

    For poison cuts springer would be the best option, but if you can't afford it, go for either murpa or msl (it doesn't really matter). But if you were to go full poison, msl would be better in most cases and if you were to go full vc, rune would be better (I think?).
    King_Kupo
  • UinixUinix
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 900
    Posts: 100
    Member
    edited 6:36AM December 6, 2018
    BTW you shouldn't go for kandura's pendant unless you are planning to spend 300m+ on 3 socketing it. A good roll absolute necklace would be better and more cost effective than a kandura's pendant since the 3 slots are worth a lot more than just 7 accuracy (which you can obtain from an absolute necklace since max acc on accessories is 7 and pierce with 4% is already higher than the damage boost kanduras provides).

    FYI Varrekant's wings are better for thief if you're going poison cuts or poison build and balrog's is better if you go vc build. Melee damage modifier doesn't apply to poison skills and the 5% attack speed would be better in terms of damage vs the 4% melee damage. Varrekant's wings can also be better against balrog in vc builds, but I've never tested that out.
    Vendal
  • WallSeriesWallSeries
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 1,460
    Posts: 244
    Member
    King_Kupo wrote: »
    WallSeries wrote: »
    King_Kupo wrote: »
    Apologies for bumping a thread that’s a month old but I can’t seem to find another post that addresses my questions exclusively...

    I currently have a thief and am running FD like no other to get good stats on a set of daggers but I tend to see a lot of thieves running Ancient Rune daggers... I understand that the main reason for this is the attack speed buff; more AS = more cunning procs = more opportunity to use skills that are enhanced by cunning.

    So I guess i have three questions here...
    1. Wouldn’t the “DPS drop” from running ancient rune instead of murpagoth be negligible since the AS buff allows you to use more enhanced abilities?

    2. If the damage is NOT negligible and it is a big difference in DPS...
    Is the fun of ancient rune worth the drop in DPS from not running Murpagoth?

    3. Lastly, is MSL also a viable option in both DPS and fun playability?
    since ur thief, having faster spirit recovery mean more dps....
    for 1 and 2, its safe to say that 1% melee = 1% attack speed
    lets say u have 50% dmg or 50% speed
    if every clap is 100s, 4 spirits per hit
    u get 150s a hit, 1 hit per second, 2 seconds = 300s, 8 spirits
    u get 100s a hit, 1.5 hit per second, 2 seconds = 300s, 12 spirits
    in short term, having % melee is better
    in long term, having % speed is better
    since u know, u don’t usually have 150% attack speed... so u dont get the bonus value out of attack speed as fast as u get from % melee

    Murp/MSL are good for Posion or VC build
    Rune is good for VC build

    assume the proc for all 3 weapons are the same....lets say it proc a few seconds after the effect ends and they dont proc if the effect is taking place
    wouldnt Murp/Rune proc pretty often with their short duration and high bonus value?
    if it procs so often, why use something like MSL that give low bonus value and long duration?
    MSL is good if the proc chance is extremely low, but it seems to proc very often to me...

    Murp/MSL are good if ur on posion and have kandura’s necklace
    Rune is will get u killed faster with kandura’s necklace in VC build.... cost hp per hit.....
    Murp is a best option for most build, but MSL might be better depending on how u proc SA.... Haste is also a problem that might afftect ur dps in many way....

    I see. I can see why it makes sense that in the short term the damage stat would matter more than attack speed.

    Then to reiterate one of the questions I had...

    HOW much of a difference does the DPS between Murpa and Rune make?
    If we’re talking in terms of short time and long time, let’s say we hit the dummy for 10 minutes how big is that difference?

    I don’t need actual numbers if someone’s already tested this, I would simply like an answer.

    And what about Leki’s build? The hybrid poison AND VC build? Which weapon is good for that build?
    Rune
    ~8%on VC build, it doesnt affect SK in anyway so all the dps comes from DS and VC,
    ~10-15% on Hyrid, it doesnt affect PE, PV, SA, SK.... so everything is on RG, DS and VC
    Murp
    ~5% VC depends heavily on crit dmg/rate, i dont have that(base)... cant say much.....
    Hyrid is 15-20% more dps compare to VC

    lekis running hyrid, hes using springer....
    MSL is the safest choice if u dont have the mechanics to keep up.... stable dps
    Murp is alright if u have the mechanics but u gotta hope it procs often... or else ur losing out lots of dps
    Rune is fair.... but if ur using posions, ur losing out on dps by alot, attack speed doesnt increases DOTs from posions, so its probably work best with just VC....

    i would recommend MSL if ur doing hyrid
  • VendalVendal
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 1,090
    Posts: 59
    Member
    Again tho dont forget. Rune results in more spirit and faster re poison edge application (which triggers a tick per hit) so although it doesnt effect dots for a full pv pe build it works great with a PE dmg centric build.