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"Style Crate" by Jungsoo Lee

NXACuddlesNXACuddles
Maplestory 2 Rep: 62,725
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edited 6:53PM October 9, 2018 in Team Blogs
Dear Maplers,

After today's livestream, we got some feedback regarding the Style Crate and, more specifically, the Style Coin Shop.

The primary feedback we received was that the price of the outfits and other cosmetic items in the Coin Shop are too expensive. We take everyone's feedback seriously and, although we took very long time to come to the shop's current model, we decided to give the Style Coin Shop a fresh look, based on the recent feedback.

Putting aside the topic of profitability, I would like to emphasize, the current monetization model we are pursuing is the result of a lot of hard work from the team here at Nexon America. We have removed most of the best sellers in other services, and we decided to be very transparent with rates and avoid playing games with tiny odds for the best items. While, we agree current price can be viewed as too expensive, I would like to provide compliment towards the team who worked on the monetization model, for removing all items with potential pay to win issues and creating a guaranteed pool of items in the Style Crate, as well as restructuring and lowering the fee for the Design Shop, compared to other regions.

But, again, we truly value your feedback, and while we know it's very difficult to make changes that will satisfy everyone, we would like to try our best. As such, we had meeting with the development studio and came to the agreement: We are lowering the price for the Style coin shop items.

pumpkin-witch-package.jpg

I am very happy to share that, we are going to lower the price of all the items in the coin shop by 30%.

Based on the new price, the most exclusive item we have in the coin shop "Pumpkin Witch Package" which has five different outfit pieces, and with a full set providing special effects will be now priced at 76 coins. Because each item gives out 1 to 3 coins when you dismantle, and based on the rate we expect average of 1.65 coins per one Style Crate, meaning the most expensive package in coin shop will require approximately $125 USD. (Again, because of random %, this value can fluctuate)

We felt that it was important that these valuable packages items should be directly available, rather than relying on other methods to increase its rarity. As always, we look forward to hearing to your feedback on this and other aspects of our Meret Shop decisions.

A more detailed list of items in the coin shop with its price will be announced tomorrow. Again, every items will have 30% lower price points when we launch tomorrow.

We will always work hard to make right decision for the community, and we hope this change is reasonable for our community.

Best,
Jungsoo Lee
mmviiSeeMintyliciousAxyJaqenNOOBYIAMTalnovaRazzCatalystWarameand 5 others.

Comments

  • HoIyHoIy
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 4,170
    Posts: 247
    Member
    Higher prices for cosmetic is something I'm happy to pay if you guys stay true to non p2w monetization. I hope people can understand that this is the price you pay for well....fairer game play. Not everything can be dirt cheap. Thanks for lowering the prices regardless.
    MagicPoptartMintyliciousNOOBYIAMMoofeyKanraChanShadowsBeneaTamakiSakuraPoofcatNahoSKillerand 2 others.
  • SeasiderSeasider
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 2,755
    Posts: 40
    Member
    HoIy wrote: »
    Higher prices for cosmetic is something I'm happy to pay if you guys stay true to non p2w monetization. I hope people can understand that this is the price you pay for well....fairer game play. Not everything can be dirt cheap. Thanks for lowering the prices regardless.

    But in the same sense, I'd much rather pay a higher price for the items I want guaranteed in the Premium Shop, over a bunch of lootboxes where there is no guarantee unless you purchase a large number of boxes. I understand the need for monetization, but why do you have to rely on lootboxes? Especially after current controversies and gambling regulations. Kids who think "oo shiny!" or people with gambling problems could so easily see something they like and think "oh I'll just buy a few boxes to to try and get what I want" before realising they've spend over $100 for a single outfit set? A couple hundred for a couple of outfit sets?
    Darkpixie99Jaqenmirta000ZatchCariseiFantasykittenNazuroAlways_HidNyxMoonKhrisisand 18 others.
  • Darkpixie99Darkpixie99
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 2,940
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    So scam for $100+ has been confirmed!
    Wow Nexon, you guys never fail to whale players off the servers due to RNG cosmetics.
    CariseiFantasykittenWliaVanBlazeKingKaeruM4XXHeartdonor
  • SeeSee
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 935
    Posts: 28
    Member
    So scam for $100+ has been confirmed!
    Wow Nexon, you guys never fail to whale players off the servers due to RNG cosmetics.
    So scam for $100+ has been confirmed!
    Wow Nexon, you guys never fail to whale players off the servers due to RNG cosmetics.

    Heh never fails no matter what they do that whiners will whine. It's a cosmetic that provides no benefit to your character besides looking cooler and it's obviously not required to play the game. If you want to be cheap there's thousands of other cosmetics you can get in game. Nexon has NOTHING PAY TO Win in the game at all, of course their top tier #1 full costume is going to be $100.

    Path of exile uses a cosmetic only mtx shop as well and one of their full costumes costs 250$+ easily. The wings by themselves are 40-70$.

    Being that MS2 is cosmetic only, these prices are more than fair. Not every costume is 100$. You can put together other full costumes for like 15 bucks. If you want a headgear only it's like 2 bucks.

    If you don't want to pay anything, guess what folks? You don't need to buy anything. You suffer no disadvantage over someone who spent 100k.
    Enough with the crying and enjoy the fact that the game isn't pay to win at all. Jeez
    MintyliciousHamicoWarameRhytidomeKanraChanBebopSyrusMarufujiValrosKozyXenostars
  • XenophobiaXenophobia
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 400
    Posts: 10
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    So scam for $100+ has been confirmed!
    Wow Nexon, you guys never fail to whale players off the servers due to RNG cosmetics.

    You wanna look nice, gotta pay the price.
    IvkKozyXenostarsSeraphicXHope
  • MintyliciousMintylicious
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 1,405
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    edited 8:33PM October 9, 2018
    HoIy wrote: »
    Higher prices for cosmetic is something I'm happy to pay if you guys stay true to non p2w monetization. I hope people can understand that this is the price you pay for well....fairer game play. Not everything can be dirt cheap. Thanks for lowering the prices regardless.

    I feel the same.

    Perhaps in the future they could consider allowing the outfits/items be bought outside the crate with merits somehow, too. Regardless, I'll be buying a style crate tomorrow to help support Nexon's quick response to the livestream comments, even though randomness isn't typically my thing.
    NOOBYIAM
  • SteezychanSteezychan
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 550
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    As stated by others, they are cosmetics and provide no advantage at all except looking cute and what not. It's no different than buying some brand name item in the real world. You don't need it, but if you want it... you'll pay for it. It's just silly to see complaints about something that doesn't change anything except your look... the lowering of the price is nice but you must remember in order for them to make money, they need to do something to gain in order to keep the game flourishing. Crying isn't gonna change that.
    MintyliciousNOOBYIAM
  • HoIyHoIy
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 4,170
    Posts: 247
    Member
    Seasider wrote: »
    HoIy wrote: »
    Higher prices for cosmetic is something I'm happy to pay if you guys stay true to non p2w monetization. I hope people can understand that this is the price you pay for well....fairer game play. Not everything can be dirt cheap. Thanks for lowering the prices regardless.

    But in the same sense, I'd much rather pay a higher price for the items I want guaranteed in the Premium Shop, over a bunch of lootboxes where there is no guarantee unless you purchase a large number of boxes. I understand the need for monetization, but why do you have to rely on lootboxes? Especially after current controversies and gambling regulations. Kids who think "oo shiny!" or people with gambling problems could so easily see something they like and think "oh I'll just buy a few boxes to to try and get what I want" before realising they've spend over $100 for a single outfit set? A couple hundred for a couple of outfit sets?

    That's a fair opinion to have and I'm not sure how I personally feel about it either. I like spending a few dollars here and there to see if I can get good drop rather then 40-70$ right from the get go like some other games have it. The fact that these items are all 1% chance rather than the rare items being small(some games have it below 0.5%) makes it feel a lot better for me.

    One thing I know for sure is that they will make way more money with this style then just selling it out right. Which is something I'm okay with since let's not forget these are just cosmetics. They don't have any real influence on game play. There are plenty of UGCs etc that we can buy if we don't want to gamble. As for little kids being entice to buying this stuff I'm a firm believer that parents are responsible for what their kids do online or anything for that matter. We can't always design everything around little kids.

    MintyliciousSteezychanRaphaelOnealmmvii
  • RaphaelOnealRaphaelOneal
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 1,050
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    HoIy wrote: »
    Seasider wrote: »
    HoIy wrote: »
    Higher prices for cosmetic is something I'm happy to pay if you guys stay true to non p2w monetization. I hope people can understand that this is the price you pay for well....fairer game play. Not everything can be dirt cheap. Thanks for lowering the prices regardless.

    But in the same sense, I'd much rather pay a higher price for the items I want guaranteed in the Premium Shop, over a bunch of lootboxes where there is no guarantee unless you purchase a large number of boxes. I understand the need for monetization, but why do you have to rely on lootboxes? Especially after current controversies and gambling regulations. Kids who think "oo shiny!" or people with gambling problems could so easily see something they like and think "oh I'll just buy a few boxes to to try and get what I want" before realising they've spend over $100 for a single outfit set? A couple hundred for a couple of outfit sets?

    That's a fair opinion to have and I'm not sure how I personally feel about it either. I like spending a few dollars here and there to see if I can get good drop rather then 40-70$ right from the get go like some other games have it. The fact that these items are all 1% chance rather than the rare items being small(some games have it below 0.5%) makes it feel a lot better for me.

    One thing I know for sure is that they will make way more money with this style then just selling it out right. Which is something I'm okay with since let's not forget these are just cosmetics. They don't have any real influence on game play. There are plenty of UGCs etc that we can buy if we don't want to gamble. As for little kids being entice to buying this stuff I'm a firm believer that parents are responsible for what their kids do online or anything for that matter. We can't always design everything around little kids.

    Agreed cosmetic boxes are fine by me long as gears arent in place in rng boxes. Spent quite a bit in Maplestory 1 on boxes just to advance my gear via rng boxes back in the day.... lol........
  • Darkpixie99Darkpixie99
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 2,940
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    Member
    edited 10:08PM October 9, 2018
    HoIy wrote: »
    Higher prices for cosmetic is something I'm happy to pay if you guys stay true to non p2w monetization. I hope people can understand that this is the price you pay for well....fairer game play. Not everything can be dirt cheap. Thanks for lowering the prices regardless.

    I feel the same.

    Perhaps in the future they could consider allowing the outfits/items be bought outside the crate with merits somehow, too. Regardless, I'll be buying a style crate tomorrow to help support Nexon's quick response to the livestream comments, even though randomness isn't typically my thing.

    They won't.
    Kids these days are so gullible, they don't even bother to read.
    Axy wrote: »
    It's incredible how much complaining is still going on in this thread with basically no pay to win elements being brought to the game, and i mean ACTUAL pay to win, not convenience stuff like rotors air taxis and 5% speed buff. But game breaking stuff like costume gems and meret revival.

    It's a free to play game and they need money to keep the game running, be thankful they're doing it in the form of costumes over game breaking stuff.

    You people will literally take any chance you get to jump on the forums and complain, if nothing is good enough for you then dont play video games lmfao.

    No, but you see... the exclusivity of items in the gamble Loot Crate items makes it so that winning the game won't be any fun.
    The worst part is the complete removal of the status gems, which could've been dropped in raids, but were removed entirely.
    You see, the problem players in Mabinogi see are doomed to witness, is that Gachapons get all of Nexon's attention.
    It's so much attention to new items and furniture in cute little gamble packages, that crafting and raiding eventually become obsolete.
    Four to eight years go by without any updates to F2P item drops whatsoever.
    Without raiders to binge on x4-x10 Exp/Drop Pots, all Nexon has left to feed on for money, are the poor and gullible gamblers who spend money on Gachapons.
    I've already discussed this in the official Monetization thread:

    One
    Two
    (Everything from Dev FUD to the RNG in two beautiful packages.)

    Loot Crate Anti Gambling Laws Comment

    Oh, and my vote is that if other countries find it an illegal form of gambling, then it's not worth the risk of Nexon getting sued. (Again.)
    Also the main problem child to use as an excuse and example, is Mabinogi.
    The once flourishing game died (Is dying) will die due to F2P Crafting Item update neglect, and the endless ravaging waterfall known as gachapons.
    The fact that they advertise the rates at 1% for 100 items total just put the nail in Nexon's coffin.
    tenor.gif?itemid=11012853
    Carisei
  • JetUppercutJetUppercut
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 3,870
    Posts: 209
    Member
    Okay, so you removed the other 'major money makers' from the two other versions of the game. That is, the costume gems and dungeon entry tickets.
    Which is great.
    But then you come to the conclusion that, because you only have one area of the game left to really monetize, you should make it as consumer unfriendly as possible?
    And you think that just because you're honest about how you'll rip them off, that it will make people want to dive headfirst into spending hundreds on lootboxes?
    Maybe there's a piece of the puzzle I'm missing here, but this train of thought doesn't really make a whole lot of sense to me.
    I don't even particularly care about the lootboxes, I hate having over the top fancy looking characters anyway.
    Just trying to understand what you're thinking with all these seemingly random decisions.
    Darkpixie99mirta000CariseiFantasykittenVanBlazeSeasiderbunlilyKingKaeruemperor52Heartdonorand 1 other.
  • MochaLatteMochaLatte
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 4,380
    Posts: 195
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    edited 2:32AM October 10, 2018
    Completely unacceptable. You could solve this easily by putting all the box contents in the coin shop, OR by making all the drops tradeable on the market before being equipped. You did neither, and this means that all of the items that are in the box and not in the coin shop, now cost hundreds and hundreds of dollars to obtain, and thousands if it's a set of items.

    I want the Holy Seraphim set for example, it's 4 pieces. Even though they are common drops, it is still a 1% chance to get just one of the pieces, and you need all 4 with no duplicates. The chance of pulling the ONE item you want in ONE HUNDRED BOXES, is roughly 65%. The chance of you pulling all 4 items to complete the outfit is far far lower, likely requiring 200-400 boxes. Even if the boxes were only $1 each that would still be completely unacceptable, but they're likely to be $2-3 instead, making it THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS for one outfit that used to cost $8-10 or so.

    A ) If all the items were tradeable, you could sell what you didn't want and buy what you do want, you could always get exactly what you want, even if you had to pay a bit more because the item was in high demand and thus priced higher by players. Boxes like this could only be purchaseable with blue merets.

    B ) If all the box items were available in the coin shop, you could just dismantle what you pull and pay the coins for it, and even though it would be at a premium, it would be vastly preferable to LITERALLY THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS FOR ONE OUTFIT WHICH IS THE SYSTEM YOU ARE ABOUT TO RELEASE AND RUIN YOUR GAME WITH. Boxes like this could be purchased with blues or reds.

    PLEASE DELAY THE BOXES AND REWORK THEM. FILL THE NORMAL CASH SHOP LIKE IT IS IN KMS/CMS IN THE MEAN TIME, AND THEN REWORK THE RANDOM BOX SYSTEM TO DROP TRADEABLE PACKAGES/VOUCHERS FOR THE ITEMS THAT ALLOW PLAYERS TO JUDGE THE VALUES OF VARIOUS ITEMS ON THEIR OWN, ALSO ALLOWING USERS TO SEEK OUT AND BUY WHAT THEY WANT WITHOUT HAVING TO ROLL THOUSANDS AND THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS WORTH OF BOXES TO PULL ONE SPECIFIC ITEM (EVEN THE SMALLEST, LAMEST ITEM THAT USED TO SELL IN THE SHOP FOR <$2).

    MS1 already uses the tradeable drops for their style boxes, it works great, it's a proven system, so why change it?! The brand new super high demand items end up at $15-30 in the auction house, and all the unwanted stuff makes it down below the price of the box. It creates demand for the boxes as you can get lucky and make a ton of profit, and if you get lucky twice and get duplicates of the best item you actually get a return for that (rather than just a measely 3 style coins that this system gives u). It also creates tons of variety in the customization scene, as items that no one would buy at equal prices, are suddenly being bought and utilized because of how much cheaper they are when players control the prices. For example on the normal cash shop, you'd price two overalls at 500 merets each, and if one is super ugly or really niche, 98% of players are going to buy the cooler option in favor of it. But when dropped from boxes and freely sold by players, the good overall might work its way to 900 merets on the market, where the ugly one falls all the way to 100, incentivizing players to get creative with less impressive items because of the draw of how many more outfits and options they can have if they go for the cheaper items..... Flash back to your coin shop design, the horrible items dismantle into just as many coins as the great ones, so they'll all be deleted and never utilized by anyone, and in the case someone does want one of those undesireable items, it would cost them $200-2000+ to get it, as opposed to the <$1 it would go for on the open market, so they would never even attempt, and that deletes huge volumes of potential sales. If a player wants a $5 overall, they might pay $12 for it because it was nice and in high demand on the market, but they sure as hell aren't going to turn that into a $200+ endeavor to merely ATTEMPT to attain that one dress. In no world is it reasonable, so you are guaranteed to turn potential payers into never payers, if not make people quit the game entirely if they were particularly interested in the social aspects of the game.
    Darkpixie99mirta000CariseiGrizzybehrNazuroAlways_HidGricelyJaqenRikkuleBebopand 9 others.
  • mirta000mirta000
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    The most expensive direct shop costume in KMS2 and CMS2 cost 50$, because it offered stats.

    Our direct shop no longer sells outfit packages AT ALL. We mostly just get starter items repeated and some accessories. I am very happy that I played mushking now, because outside of the middle founder's pack dress, there's no way I could make an outfit that looks exclusive from Nexon's on offer things.

    And that's the exact issue with our loot crates. You took literally everything that was pretty off the store during CBT2 and shoved it in a crate.
    CariseiNazuroDarkpixie99SeasiderKingKaeruMorningRegretHeartdonor
  • HoIyHoIy
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    MochaLatte wrote: »
    You could solve this easily by putting all the box contents in the coin shop, OR by making all the drops tradeable on the market before being equipped. You did neither, and this means that all of the items that are in the box and not in the coin shop, now cost hundreds and hundreds of dollars to obtain, and thousands if it's a set of items.

    Making the drops trade-able would make the game completely p2w which is why they removed other monetization methods.
    Talnova
  • FeverJawsFeverJaws
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    alot of whiners. that doesn't know this is a fair way of doing it. you have no need to buy them if you dont want to. its a choice. and the fact that its also not tradeable is amazing. i like the way its going.
    Talnova
  • HamicoHamico
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 1,675
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    See wrote: »
    So scam for $100+ has been confirmed!
    Wow Nexon, you guys never fail to whale players off the servers due to RNG cosmetics.
    So scam for $100+ has been confirmed!
    Wow Nexon, you guys never fail to whale players off the servers due to RNG cosmetics.

    Heh never fails no matter what they do that whiners will whine. It's a cosmetic that provides no benefit to your character besides looking cooler and it's obviously not required to play the game. If you want to be cheap there's thousands of other cosmetics you can get in game. Nexon has NOTHING PAY TO Win in the game at all, of course their top tier #1 full costume is going to be $100.

    Path of exile uses a cosmetic only mtx shop as well and one of their full costumes costs 250$+ easily. The wings by themselves are 40-70$.

    Being that MS2 is cosmetic only, these prices are more than fair. Not every costume is 100$. You can put together other full costumes for like 15 bucks. If you want a headgear only it's like 2 bucks.

    If you don't want to pay anything, guess what folks? You don't need to buy anything. You suffer no disadvantage over someone who spent 100k.
    Enough with the crying and enjoy the fact that the game isn't pay to win at all. Jeez

    Thank you!
  • FeverJawsFeverJaws
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 805
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    See wrote: »
    So scam for $100+ has been confirmed!
    Wow Nexon, you guys never fail to whale players off the servers due to RNG cosmetics.
    So scam for $100+ has been confirmed!
    Wow Nexon, you guys never fail to whale players off the servers due to RNG cosmetics.

    Heh never fails no matter what they do that whiners will whine. It's a cosmetic that provides no benefit to your character besides looking cooler and it's obviously not required to play the game. If you want to be cheap there's thousands of other cosmetics you can get in game. Nexon has NOTHING PAY TO Win in the game at all, of course their top tier #1 full costume is going to be $100.

    Path of exile uses a cosmetic only mtx shop as well and one of their full costumes costs 250$+ easily. The wings by themselves are 40-70$.

    Being that MS2 is cosmetic only, these prices are more than fair. Not every costume is 100$. You can put together other full costumes for like 15 bucks. If you want a headgear only it's like 2 bucks.

    If you don't want to pay anything, guess what folks? You don't need to buy anything. You suffer no disadvantage over someone who spent 100k.
    Enough with the crying and enjoy the fact that the game isn't pay to win at all. Jeez

    what are u on about. Poe a full costume cost 30-40$ and wings cost 20-30$.
    Specks
  • mirta000mirta000
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 5,765
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    FeverJaws wrote: »
    alot of whiners. that doesn't know this is a fair way of doing it. you have no need to buy them if you dont want to. its a choice. and the fact that its also not tradeable is amazing. i like the way its going.

    well you see before headstart I was under the impression that I could buy some outfits directly from the store, like it was in CBT2. I guess Nexon doesn't want my money after all.
    CariseiFantasykittenDarkpixie99SeasiderbunlilyMorningRegretSpecksAieemperor52Heartdonorand 1 other.
  • MochaLatteMochaLatte
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 4,380
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    edited 3:23AM October 10, 2018
    HoIy wrote: »
    MochaLatte wrote: »
    You could solve this easily by putting all the box contents in the coin shop, OR by making all the drops tradeable on the market before being equipped. You did neither, and this means that all of the items that are in the box and not in the coin shop, now cost hundreds and hundreds of dollars to obtain, and thousands if it's a set of items.

    Making the drops trade-able would make the game completely p2w which is why they removed other monetization methods.

    I can't even... That is outright false.

    1. The game has always been, and will forever remain, pay2win. They lessened some of the more egregious systems which is nice, but you can absolutely still pay for countless advantages. Character slots for farming mules, premium club for all of it's teleporting/speed/potion/fee benefits, top-tier air and ground mounts, elixirs to make dungeons a fraction as difficult, mesos through the meret-to-meso market to buy any gear that is tradeable and all the weapon upgrade materials, auto-fishing/music to level up all of your alts with zero effort past the tutorial, and much more.

    2. The meret-to-meso market, cash shop gifting, and even ToS-breaking 3rd party trades, are all in the game. If you want to buy power, you absolutely can through 3 separate means that exist completely regardless of whether or not you can trade the style crate drops. The only way to rid this, is to completely and totally shut down trade of everything. If ANYTHING is tradeable, it can be farmed and sold off to players willing to spend cash. I don't actually want that, I think trading is great regardless of how pay2win the game becomes (because it's >95% pve/social), but the style crates should follow suit.

    Because IT IS ABSOLUTELY A PAY2WIN GAME, that is exactly why the cosmetic side of the game needs to be reasonably monetized. Fortnite skins for example are stupidly expensive, but the game is completely free and not in any way pay2win. Overwatch is slightly different, in that you pay the box cost of the game to access the 100% not pay2win environment, and because that portion is paid for, the cosmetics aren't quite as expensive as fortnite and can usually be earned for free. Maplestory 1 and 2 are both completely pay2win, and thus there is no justification at all for the cosmetics to be in a system that makes even the most basic items cost thousands of dollars. Tradeable style crate drops allows the community to dictate the prices and crowd-source finding specific items for the players who want them. That already earns far more money than a basic cash shop, as countless extra items are purchased that wouldn't have been purchased if players had a choice, so they don't also need to completely lock down all the items with extreme exclusivity that multiplies their prices by 100x or more. Random tradeable drops is enough of a scheme, where them being untradeable with no guaranteed progression path (the box items not being also available in the coin shop) is as close as you get to an outright scam, and one of the most anti-consumer systems you could possibly come up with. That's not even to mention the male/female locks, literally the only thing they could possibly do to make it worse from here is if they items were character-locked too, that's it, it's already that close to being the worst system possible.

    Overwatch actually already had this system, and players backlashed so hard that Blizzard had to remove the duplicates mechanic, and it's boxes were likely 33-50% of the price AND are earnable at about 1hr of playtime each. Unless MS2's are also earnable for free and similarly cheap to buy, it makes the style crates insanely predatory and anti-consumer. Having no anti-duplicate system and no guaranteed path of progress, again makes basically all of the items cost hundreds if not thousands of dollars each, for absolutely no reason at all, with absolutely no justification (NOT based on rarity combined with natural consumer demand, like it is for games like CSGO).

    And even though I was still arguing for loot boxes just implemented with one small tweak, this is all ignoring the fact that like a dozen countries are in the middle of completely banning loot boxes from games and classifying them as real gambling (which they absolutely are, tradeable items or not). At least when the lawmakers come knocking, maybe you'd want a system that the consumers enjoyed engaging with on some level, which is what tradeable drops would do, as opposed to the entire playerbase being perpetually furious, which I assure you is what will happen when players realize how impossible it is to get even the tiniest little item they want from this system.

    Finally, if they were to go the 100% non-pay2win route, removing any and all forms of trading from the whole game, there's another way to solve this. Just make all of the style crate drops ALSO available from the main cash shop and/or the style coin shop. The crates would then act as a bundle discount where the contents are random, and if you fail you could buy the item individually for a higher price either before or after.
    CariseiGrizzybehrSeasiderSyrusMarufujiJubbesemperor52MarchinBunny
  • FeverJawsFeverJaws
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    edited 5:36AM October 15, 2018
    MochaLatte wrote: »
    HoIy wrote: »
    MochaLatte wrote: »
    You could solve this easily by putting all the box contents in the coin shop, OR by making all the drops tradeable on the market before being equipped. You did neither, and this means that all of the items that are in the box and not in the coin shop, now cost hundreds and hundreds of dollars to obtain, and thousands if it's a set of items.

    Making the drops trade-able would make the game completely p2w which is why they removed other monetization methods.

    I can't even... That is outright false.

    1. The game has always been, and will forever remain, pay2win. They lessened some of the more egregious systems which is nice, but you can absolutely still pay for countless advantages. Character slots for farming mules, premium club for all of it's teleporting/speed/potion/fee benefits, top-tier air and ground mounts, elixirs to make dungeons a fraction as difficult, mesos through the meret-to-meso market to buy any gear that is tradeable and all the weapon upgrade materials, auto-fishing/music to level up all of your alts with zero effort past the tutorial, and much more.

    2. The meret-to-meso market, cash shop gifting, and even ToS-breaking 3rd party trades, are all in the game. If you want to buy power, you absolutely can through 3 separate means that exist completely regardless of whether or not you can trade the style crate drops. The only way to rid this, is to completely and totally shut down trade of everything. If ANYTHING is tradeable, it can be farmed and sold off to players willing to spend cash. I don't actually want that, I think trading is great regardless of how pay2win the game becomes (because it's >95% pve/social), but the style crates should follow suit.

    Because IT IS ABSOLUTELY A PAY2WIN GAME, that is exactly why the cosmetic side of the game needs to be reasonably monetized. Fortnite skins for example are stupidly expensive, but the game is completely free and not in any way pay2win. Overwatch is slightly different, in that you pay the box cost of the game to access the 100% not pay2win environment, and because that portion is paid for, the cosmetics aren't quite as expensive as fortnite and can usually be earned for free. Maplestory 1 and 2 are both completely pay2win, and thus there is no justification at all for the cosmetics to be in a system that makes even the most basic items cost thousands of dollars. Tradeable style crate drops allows the community to dictate the prices and crowd-source finding specific items for the players who want them. That already earns far more money than a basic cash shop, as countless extra items are purchased that wouldn't have been purchased if players had a choice, so they don't also need to completely lock down all the items with extreme exclusivity that multiplies their prices by 100x or more. Random tradeable drops is enough of a scheme, where them being untradeable with no guaranteed progression path (the box items not being also available in the coin shop) is as close as you get to an outright scam, and one of the most anti-consumer systems you could possibly come up with. That's not even to mention the male/female locks, literally the only thing they could possibly do to make it worse from here is if they items were character-locked too, that's it, it's already that close to being the worst system possible.

    Overwatch actually already had this system, and players backlashed so hard that Blizzard had to remove the duplicates mechanic, and it's boxes were likely 33-50% of the price AND are earnable at about 1hr of playtime each. Unless MS2's are also earnable for free and similarly cheap to buy, it makes the style crates insanely predatory and anti-consumer. Having no anti-duplicate system and no guaranteed path of progress, again makes basically all of the items cost hundreds if not thousands of dollars each, for absolutely no reason at all, with absolutely no justification (NOT based on rarity combined with natural consumer demand, like it is for games like CSGO).

    And even though I was still arguing for loot boxes just implemented with one small tweak, this is all ignoring the fact that like a dozen countries are in the middle of completely banning loot boxes from games and classifying them as real gambling (which they absolutely are, tradeable items or not). At least when the lawmakers come knocking, maybe you'd want a system that the consumers enjoyed engaging with on some level, which is what tradeable drops would do, as opposed to the entire playerbase being perpetually furious, which I assure you is what will happen when players realize how impossible it is to get even the tiniest little item they want from this system.

    Finally, if they were to go the 100% non-pay2win route, removing any and all forms of trading from the whole game, there's another way to solve this. Just make all of the style crate drops ALSO available from the main cash shop and/or the style coin shop. The crates would then act as a bundle discount where the contents are random, and if you fail you could buy the item individually for a higher price either before or after.


    where is the p2w route atm? cause there is non. so stop being so lame. and overwatch no one complained about anything. duplicates still exists. so i dont know where u get that wrong information from. but all i see is your whine