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Thief hate rant.

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  • PuppyPowrPuppyPowr
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    I love how when I watched Youtube videos, everybody was like "Don't play thief, you will only be wasting your time playing it compared to the other ones", as you mentioned in your post. Since I used all of my character slots except for one, I thought to myself "I'm going to try thief anyway, cause I'm curious to see why everyone says the class is bad." When I created it, immediately I was amazed on how the class functions compared to the other classes. It involves more attention than the others, but that is what makes this class so exciting compared to the rest. At first, I said I was gonna main a Knight, but now I'm going to main a thief, despite what others say about it.
    NightThief
  • hotpothotpot
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    edited 12:07AM October 19, 2018
    I mean it's not bad to the point where we should be kicked from parties but people are kind of right about thieves.
    The class requires so much more micromanagement and theorycrafting than any other, and its skill rotations are by far the most diverse compared to any other. Not only do you have to pay the most attention during your rotation, but due to being close range and squishy to perform well you need to show knowledge of a fight and its mechanics.
    And since our damage is calculated across the hits of both daggers, like Assassins we too can find it costly to fully upgrade our gear in order to perform well.

    So with all these disadvantages and extra effort, you'd expect the DPS would reflect this but it doesn't. In fact if a skilled Thief is in the same party as another class of equal skill the Thief will almost always end up short.
    Yes other classes can provide a lower output too but they're either ranged or tanky as hell to compensate for being close range... We aren't. So if you're bringing a class to a very, very jumpy boss Thief is nothing but a risk.
    Milln wrote: »
    I got called out for playing Poison build on Thief in a Blueshade run by a Berserker once and it was implied that he/she wasn't happy with me. I asked for their damage for the end of the run and they didn't respond. The MVP thing at the end happened to highlight my damage as highest that run.

    GG forgettable berserker player. May you one day not parrot what you read on the internet.

    I'm not justifying their behaviour, but they may have been calling DoT build specifically because of recent debate that raw DoT build isn't actually the best DPS we can achieve. I'm going to be doing some testing over the weekend but something incorporating haste and mesoguard with cuts might actually be better.
    booger
  • NightThiefNightThief
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    At the end of the day, I play games in which I have to learn the bosses attack pattern and know my weapon, monster hunter isnan example and it is way harder than maple 2. So this will be no problem for me xD
  • RedCultistRedCultist
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    just mad that thief doesnt have a stealth ability... as far as balance goes it is a close range dps that cant drop its aggro... and on the meta side how can a thief commit crimes if he cant hide.
  • _Lil_Puddin__Lil_Puddin_
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    RedCultist wrote: »
    just mad that thief doesnt have a stealth ability... as far as balance goes it is a close range dps that cant drop its aggro... and on the meta side how can a thief commit crimes if he cant hide.
    Personality wise our thief boi/gorl is pretty brazen and not stealthy at all. But he/she is also generous... So why his Haste isn't a type of party buff is something that I don't fully understand. At least this way theif's middling DPS would be kinda justified with a movement spd/attack speed buff.

    At least the poison DoT is kind of their way of contributing while kiting around a boss, except they really should be built around poisons/bleeds given how they have to be played. Instead they're built around a few poisons and relying on RNG/procs to deal OK dps all while trying to survive. Oopsie.
  • RedCultistRedCultist
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    RedCultist wrote: »
    just mad that thief doesnt have a stealth ability... as far as balance goes it is a close range dps that cant drop its aggro... and on the meta side how can a thief commit crimes if he cant hide.
    Personality wise our thief boi/gorl is pretty brazen and not stealthy at all. But he/she is also generous... So why his Haste isn't a type of party buff is something that I don't fully understand. At least this way theif's middling DPS would be kinda justified with a movement spd/attack speed buff.

    At least the poison DoT is kind of their way of contributing while kiting around a boss, except they really should be built around poisons/bleeds given how they have to be played. Instead they're built around a few poisons and relying on RNG/procs to deal OK dps all while trying to survive. Oopsie.

    part of why im annoyed on thief not having stealth is because close range stealth is kinda what i was looking for in the class when i picked it... ranged stealth is kinda pointless because of kiteing.
    berserker deals close range damage by being able to semi-tank with self heals, the knight is a dedicated tank... what does thief get to stay alive in close combat?
    if haste had a stealth buff added it could be used to drop aggro... this loss of aggro means you dont have to spend as much time running from the boss... thus more dps.

    grand scheme of things the class doesnt live up to its name... without a close range stealth character ill prolly just move on to other games
  • ratedXcoolerratedXcooler
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    I think a big thing that will help is maybe putting either a life steal on his/her dash that does good healing or reset or lower CD the dash to help him/her evade more. I agree that thief does need ability to remove aggro like stealth.
    XreoXNightThiefVendal
  • Oldwargoat39Oldwargoat39
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    well, people who bag on Thief are either brain-dead players who can't or won't take the time to learn the rotation(s). These players do not understand what playing an MMO is like.just because one class is not your cup of tea doesn't mean it isn't a viable option or just bag on it. I could say Spinzerkers are the too stupid easy to DPS class in the game! but that is subjective as well and it doesn't prove a point. SO pretty much the people who say thief are not viable don't play the class at all and they should keep their opinions to themselves.
    NightThief
  • NightThiefNightThief
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    edited 10:22PM October 25, 2018
    PuppyPowr wrote: »
    I love how when I watched Youtube videos, everybody was like "Don't play thief, you will only be wasting your time playing it compared to the other ones", as you mentioned in your post. Since I used all of my character slots except for one, I thought to myself "I'm going to try thief anyway, cause I'm curious to see why everyone says the class is bad." When I created it, immediately I was amazed on how the class functions compared to the other classes. It involves more attention than the others, but that is what makes this class so exciting compared to the rest. At first, I said I was gonna main a Knight, but now I'm going to main a thief, despite what others say about it.

    You sir, are a real one!
    well, people who bag on Thief are either brain-dead players who can't or won't take the time to learn the rotation(s). These players do not understand what playing an MMO is like.just because one class is not your cup of tea doesn't mean it isn't a viable option or just bag on it. I could say Spinzerkers are the too stupid easy to DPS class in the game! but that is subjective as well and it doesn't prove a point. SO pretty much the people who say thief are not viable don't play the class at all and they should keep their opinions to themselves.

    It's true! They listen tonwhat a group of nubs say just to justify their lack of skill and hate of diffixulty, that they turn to hatred for the class...

    Strikers will also get this same horrible treatment and it's awful! LEARN TO PLAY right?
    -_-
  • CutsCuts
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    its funny how thief is the only real class that requires a brain yet if u compare thief to other mmorpg classes.. thief is just like playing a wow class...
    Trafi
  • TrafiTrafi
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    Cuts wrote: »
    its funny how thief is the only real class that requires a brain yet if u compare thief to other mmorpg classes.. thief is just like playing a wow class...

    shhh let the brainless classes keep thinking they are actually thinking.
  • UinixUinix
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    edited 8:57AM November 1, 2018
    Cuts wrote: »
    its funny how thief is the only real class that requires a brain yet if u compare thief to other mmorpg classes.. thief is just like playing a wow class...

    I don't mean to be off topic, but the entirety of WOW is brainless LOL. Ever since the second expansion, WOW has been significantly easier to play and the mechanics in that game now doesn't even require much effort, whereas thief you have wayyyy too many skills you're supposed to use (in a game where most classes just spam 1 skill) and the con of being melee.

  • UinixUinix
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    edited 7:35AM October 26, 2018
    just because one class is not your cup of tea doesn't mean it isn't a viable option or just bag on it.

    SO pretty much the people who say thief are not viable don't play the class at all and they should keep their opinions to themselves.

    Thief in it's current state really isn't that viable as even though the class takes skill to play and has the highest possible dps, it is impossible to pull this off and the effort to pull it off is not even worth it. Nearly all the top thief players aren't even top dps in their current parties, nor will they be due to the fact thief is just wayyy too difficult. Thief doesn't even have any party buffing skills, but if they did that would probably make thief viable, so I understand where those people's opinions are coming from. I'm not saying that the class shouldn't be played (I main thief btw), but if you do, don't expect to be top dps in any party (unless you have significantly higher rolls/gs/attack or party just sucks) and just have fun with it.
  • StabbieStabbie
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    edited 11:16AM October 26, 2018
    Uinix wrote: »
    just because one class is not your cup of tea doesn't mean it isn't a viable option or just bag on it.

    SO pretty much the people who say thief are not viable don't play the class at all and they should keep their opinions to themselves.

    Thief in it's current state really isn't that viable as even though the class takes skill to play and has the highest possible dps, it is impossible to pull this off and the effort to pull it off is not even worth it. Nearly all the top thief players aren't even top dps in their current parties, nor will they be due to the fact thief is just wayyy too difficult. Thief doesn't even have any party buffing skills, but if they did that would probably make thief viable, so I understand where those people's opinions are coming from. I'm not saying that the class shouldn't be played (I main thief btw), but if you do, don't expect to be top dps in any party (unless you have significantly higher rolls/gs/attack or party just sucks) and just have fun with it.

    EXACTLY. The white knight here saying that those who are playing thieves are just bad at the class and they are making it look bad are one of those :

    1) not 60 yet;
    2) if 1) is achieved, not running FD yet;
    3) if 1) and 2) are achieved, not comparing damage done at the end of the fight with other players in the group;
    4) if all of the above are checked and somehow ended up top dps, they are overgeared or playing with bad people;

    Change my mind! (With screenshot)

    Fyi: I main a thief with +14 and +13 daggers and from other users post, we can agree that over 30k-32k dps overall in FD, as a thief, is pretty decent. I also have an ungeared mage with only +5 weapon and with 4 skills (2 having 15sec+ cd) so basically 2 skills, i do over 32k dps with my eyes closed.

    Thief is way more fun, but wow you gotta be try hard...
    boogerMeowitzer
  • PetitPetit
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    edited 10:17AM October 27, 2018
    The complaints are valid and the community should not be stifled to express what they feel needs to be changed.
  • NightThiefNightThief
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    Uinix wrote: »
    just because one class is not your cup of tea doesn't mean it isn't a viable option or just bag on it.

    SO pretty much the people who say thief are not viable don't play the class at all and they should keep their opinions to themselves.

    Thief in it's current state really isn't that viable as even though the class takes skill to play and has the highest possible dps, it is impossible to pull this off and the effort to pull it off is not even worth it. Nearly all the top thief players aren't even top dps in their current parties, nor will they be due to the fact thief is just wayyy too difficult. Thief doesn't even have any party buffing skills, but if they did that would probably make thief viable, so I understand where those people's opinions are coming from. I'm not saying that the class shouldn't be played (I main thief btw), but if you do, don't expect to be top dps in any party (unless you have significantly higher rolls/gs/attack or party just sucks) and just have fun with it.

    Yet i'm out dpsing a lot of my team =O.
  • KyuukeiKyuukei
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    edited 4:00PM October 28, 2018
    Stabbie wrote: »
    Fyi: I main a thief with +14 and +13 daggers and from other users post, we can agree that over 30k-32k dps overall in FD, as a thief, is pretty decent.

    Well I guess I'm a rather terrible thief then. Keeping poisons up, changed build some but with +12/+10 weapons only could get 17-19k dps. Friend with heavy gunner easily out dps'd me with +8 weapon with 31k dps
    Edit: But it's fun to play. Guildhouse dummyfight 75k dps - the dps from the poison vial that hit all three targets
  • _Lil_Puddin__Lil_Puddin_
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    Stabbie wrote: »
    Thief is way more fun, but wow you gotta be try hard...
    Try hard compared to other classes, sure. At the end of the day, playing a Thief is still a fast-paced casual type of gameplay. I do understand having to do more is not fun if it doesn't yield the best results compared to less active classes. But we're supposed to pick classes by fun. Not band wagon and go "jajaja I can top dps by literally holding down this 1 macro button jaaaaaaaaaa!"

    That said...

    Fair Fight should help the Thief class. Classes with a lot of moving parts (like Thieves) get really stifled by Fair Fight.

    Still, I'd personally like for Haste to become a party buff. There's no movement speed+attack speed party buff that can be up 100% of the time. So even if it's 50% or less of the buff Thief gets applied to their party in 8m-10m AoE, it'd be good enough. It'd allow Thieves to give more to their party instead of going "Gee, how much RNG do I have to put up with today just to survive, let alone contribute enough DPS for my team? :^)"

    Relying on RNG is not a 5/5 difficulty worthy. It's fake difficulty - especially since we can do very little to manipulate the RNG in our favor. Thief is otherwise just a 3/5 difficulkty class or 4/5 at most.
    Petit wrote: »
    The complaints are valid and the community should not be stifled to express what they feel needs to be changed.
    This, but only as long as it is constructive and not straight up class-hate/complaining. Complaints and hate obviously lower the community's opinion of the Thief class. Which in turn means worse Thief-stigma when it comes to getting into parties.
  • UinixUinix
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    edited 7:19AM October 31, 2018
    Stabbie wrote: »
    EXACTLY. The white knight here saying that those who are playing thieves are just bad at the class and they are making it look bad are one of those :

    1) not 60 yet;
    2) if 1) is achieved, not running FD yet;
    3) if 1) and 2) are achieved, not comparing damage done at the end of the fight with other players in the group;
    4) if all of the above are checked and somehow ended up top dps, they are overgeared or playing with bad people;

    Change my mind! (With screenshot)

    Ngl I can't tell if you were throwing shade at me or if you were trying to agree.
    IF you were trying to throw shade though, I'm a +13/13 max piercing/boss damage and I have over 40 runs in FD. I usually only run with premade parties with 4k+ attack. I wouldn't consider myself an amazing thief, but I would consider myself as average, but I find myself struggling to surpass 30k DPS, while all of my other party members are surpassing 30k with ease (and I do all the mechs grabbing onto dashes, standing in spots where you cant be hit by tail, dpsing from the back while laser, etc). The build I'm using is poison cuts with haste and mesoguard.
  • UinixUinix
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    edited 7:08AM October 31, 2018
    NightThief wrote: »
    Yet i'm out dpsing a lot of my team =0.
    Ngl I find this hard to believe unless you're running pugs, your party is under geared/you are over geared, your parties are just bad, or you are running with classes with normally lower dps (priests, knights).
    Vendal