Please do not send inquiries to the Forum Moderators and Community Manager Cuddles regarding forum name changes. Exceptions are only made if the forum name violates the CoC. Thank you for understanding.

Progression, reward structure and interactivity

JetUppercutJetUppercut
Maplestory 2 Rep: 5,535
Posts: 299
Member
in Suggestions and Feedback
This thread is mostly going to be about how I think Nexon can restructure the game's progression system and rewards, in order to make all activities more worth doing. I feel it's a core problem of Maplestory 2 that a majority of the content is effectively rendered useless by the current system. A lot of people complain about how certain activities are useless and I think it stems from the current upgrade system kind of funneling people to do activities that reward you with those materials, since gear is the main form of progression. So this is my attempt at a solution.

Diversifying upgrading and progression

So progression as it is right now, you get Onyx Crystals and Chaos Onyx Crystals to upgrade gear and that's it. That doesn't interact with anything else in the game, you get them from dismantling items and dungeon reward chests and occasionally mission point boxes, but that's about it.
The problem here is, because you get so many Onyx Crystals from non-epic gear dismantling, the flow of upgrades stems purely from the rate you gain Chaos Onyx Crystals and people will naturally just gravitate towards that form of progression because that's where the end-game is.
This idea also isn't really meant to change the actual progression of gear stats-wise or anything. It could, I could absolutely come up with ideas for that but I feel like the system itself isn't the major problem, just how it's implemented.

My proposal is that instead of receiving Chaos/Onyx Crystals when dismantling, you receive basic crafting Catalysts. One for each profession.
So Smithing, Handicraft, Alchemy and Cooking.
It doesn't really matter what these items are, just that they exist and are unique.
The rarity of the catalysts you receive would be the same as the rarity of the item you dismantled.

You could then combine these with refined crafting materials and regular gathering materials to create different upgrade materials depending on the profession.
Smithing would have STR crystals, Handicraft DEX crystals, Alchemy INT crystals and Cooking LUK crystals. Kind of like the crystals in MS1.
These would be tiered depending on rarity, with higher tier ones requiring higher rarity items and higher profession ranks to create.
They'd also be gear specific, so Warrior gear would need STR crystals, Wizards would need INT etc.
Tier 1 would do +1~3, Tier 2 would be +4~6, Tier 3 would be +7~9 and Tier 4 would be +10~12.
You'd obviously need multiples of these items for a single upgrade.
These wouldn't be the only items required for upgrading, though.
An additional set of 3 items, Weapon, Armor and Accessory crystals, would be introduced.
These would fill the role of the Chaos Onyx and aren't tiered, but instead the number you would need would equal the upgrade level you're trying to achieve.
So +1 you would only need one weapon crystal, +12 you would need 12. Except 2 handed weapons, you'd need twice as many for those.

Because of the increase in variety and amount of materials, they could then be given out a bit more generously rather than just in dungeons/mission boxes. The catalyst materials could also be given out as mundane rewards, like materials in other games. Drops from enemies, from opening chests or as bonuses when gathering, etc.
The idea behind this is to take the pressure off that 10 dungeon a day limit, as well as making any improvements to other activities worthwhile as the modified upgrading systems would allow for a better reward structure. More materials would also create more of a market economy, since stuff people didn't need could be sold on the market.

Interaction between activities

There's a bit of a problem with how things work in MS2, where everything is sort of it's own isolated system, rather than being one part of an overarching thing, being the game itself. Fishing, Playing Music, Housing, etc. Is all kind of separate, with sparing interaction between them. This idea is sort of to incentivize doing more than just one thing.

Each crafting profession should be able to craft different baits.
Smthing could make tiered Magnet Lures, Alchemy could make tiered Gold Lures, Handicraft could make tiered Speed Lures and Cooking tiered Rare Lures.
Magnet Lures letting you catch stuff that isn't fish more frequently, Gold Lures letting you catch Gold Fish, Speed Lures letting you catch faster and Rare Lures making higher rarity fish appear more often. Tiers corresponding to the current fishing mastery level thing already in place. Rods could still be kept as rewards and vendor items. Perhaps even following a similar system so Magnet Rods, Gold Rods, Speed Rods or Rare Rods of different tiers to stack with bait. Catching fish over a certain size threshold should create a mountable trophy item of that fish for your house. Singing optional.

Musical Instruments should come with buffs, which give better effects as you get better at playing them and have longer durations as you play longer songs. They don't have to be just stat boosts either, things like increased fishing rate, faster movement, boosted EXP, etc. would be nice as well. People can be battle bards or maybe just hangout in Tria helping people fish. A donation box thing like Mabinogi would be cool too, so busking could be a thing. Poor starving artists need to make a living somehow.
Being able to craft instruments would be nice too.

With housing, being able to place fishing plots in your house would be a nice addition. Being able to put gold ranked fish you caught into specific water tiles on your property would be cool, with the mastery level required to fish there being the highest rank fish placed in your house. Being able to place other open world gathering spots like Mining and Harvesting spots would be nice. Having triggers in the house activate if someone is playing an instrument nearby would be cool. A jukebox you could put sheet music into to add a bit of personal ambience to the place would be even cooler. Being able to craft housing tiles would be neat as well.

Blueprints for crafting items being drops from exploration, given by trophy rewards and other activities would be good as well. Gold Chests giving out special blue prints for craftable housing items, instruments or even costumes would be a good incentive for people to actually go out and collect them. This could even lead into gear crafting, but I haven't really thought about that.

Changes like this, I feel, would get people to try activities they normally wouldn't do to get benefits on their main activity or just do them because there are pathways connecting between each other. Someone could start their play session by playing some fish buff music, get the fish buff, go fishing, catch a huge fish and go to their house and start making room for the big trophy fish they get. Just an example flow of how it could work, where previously there was never any kind of pathway there. It's simple stuff like this that will add longevity to the game by giving people incentives to do stuff besides that 10 a day dungeon limit as well as make it easier for people to transition between activities because progress is more open.

Anyway, if you made it this far, thanks for reading. If you skipped everything to read this, there is no tl;dr. You're just going to have to suffer.
KatsDanDKMarkMLindelysmileycatbolder_taste

Comments

  • SonFableSonFable
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 980
    Posts: 20
    Member
  • KatsKats
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 4,405
    Posts: 213
    Member
    And the tl:dr version?
    JetUppercutShadowsBenea
  • OlujiwanOlujiwan
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 7,000
    Posts: 507
    Forum Moderator
  • MarkMMarkM
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 11,570
    Posts: 398
    Member
    I actually really like the idea of re-working the upgrade system to spread upgrade materials across different aspects of the game. I feel like this would definitely incentivize players to explore everything the game has to offer outside of just grinding dungeons/raids.

    Guild Wars 2 had a pretty similar system going in regards to crafting a legendary weapon. The materials necessary for crafting a legendary could only be obtained by exploring everything that the game has to offer, whether it was traveling across the entire map, maxing out one of your crafting disciplines, or through dungeon rewards.
    JetUppercutLindely
  • DanDKDanDK
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 33,475
    Posts: 2,569
    Member
    These ideas are all very good to fix the enchantment and crafting system which is way too simple at the moment. Diversifying material requirements and rewards from the products are both suggestions I strongly hope will be implemented in some way or form, as there currently is absolutely nothing to it. Activity interaction is also a nice concept and it sounds like you've been giving it quite some thought.

    Even though these ideas don't touch on the main progression issues (levelling, combat and dungeon system) I think they could still come a long way into repairing the other issues that are currently with the side activities, focusing on improving what the game currently does better.
    Kats wrote: »
    And the tl:dr version?
    Olujiwan wrote: »
    tl;dr?
    If you skipped everything to read this, there is no tl;dr. You're just going to have to suffer.
    MarkMShadowsBeneaJetUppercutLindely
  • Always_HidAlways_Hid
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 9,900
    Posts: 1,076
    Member
    so you do have a lot of ideas in here so im gonna break it down a bit for response

    Onyx Cristals: based on life skills and enchanting being set up the way they are in game, it looks like they're trying to keep it relatively simple. your idea about crafting components and have them linked to a specific profession may not be overly complicated compared to some other mmos, but i think it may be a tad too much for the vibe the rest of ms2 professions have. i personally don't mind keeping track of multiple types of profession mats as im used to more complicated systems from other games, but i am not sure the devs want to bother implimenting something like this.

    profession crafted bait: i like this idea and think its a great way to link the profs together while still allowing people to pick and choose what profs they want to do or skip out on. i LOVE the idea of having a singing fish trophy in my house and want one desperately.

    music: i think buffs from music is a great idea, not sure why that hasn't been implemented. like if you stay listening for a certain amount of time you get a buff that could increase in both potency and duration the higher ranked musician is. also like the donation box, think it would be nice to tip players who took the time to play (whether it be for buffs or just a good music selection)

    housing: a big yes to adding fishing plots, mining and harvesting nodes to your house. on that note, i also think animal and farming nodes should be found in different cities/maps like the ores and herbs are. also, a jukebox is a major yes. it would def add something extra special, especially theme houses.

    blueprints: i think having special blueprints drop for crafting etc would be great, especially for housing blocks and gear. special outfits (maybe themed on where they drop/who they drop from) would be great to farm for, especially nice for people who don't want to/can't rely on unique outfits from the cash shop.

    all in all some really great ideas, i hope they implement them!
    JetUppercut
  • LindelyLindely
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 5,910
    Posts: 258
    Forum Moderator
    I agree with you that most activities in this game have no relation to one another, and some are way less rewarding than the others. I also think that making the upgrading system a bit more complex and reliant on more aspects of the game than just disenchanting is a good idea, but I feel like the changes you suggested in that regard will over-complicate the system for no good reason. Currently, the crafting professions already have a reasoning to be leveled, but depending on the patch we actually get, some might be more useful than others. Upgrading system can use some additional materials, obtained elsewhere, besides just disenchanting, and that would give players the reason to participate in those activities. But in my opinion it's really important to not overdo it and not over-complicate the system while trying to improve it.

    As for the feedback regarding fishing, music and housing, I agree that they can use some additions to make them more compelling, especially so music. Adding buffs to the it, and some additional bonuses to both the person who is performing and for the people listening would indeed make it more appealing and more useful feature, but it might also take away from players actually making music to share with others and lead to some players trying to cheese the system just to get the buffs. It will all depend on the way that would be implemented. Perhaps, allowing people to "vote" or "rate" the performance and building the buff system around that could work.

    Overall I think that there plenty of ways to make the game better and more engaging. I hope that moving forward more and more people will leave their suggestions on the ways to improve it or feedback on what the current system is lacking, and that someday we will also see some of those changes implemented.
    JetUppercut
  • TamakiSakuraTamakiSakura
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 6,985
    Posts: 461
    Member
    edited 12:19PM June 8, 2018
    Allow us to craft housing items.
    DanDKsmileycatJetUppercut
  • JetUppercutJetUppercut
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 5,535
    Posts: 299
    Member
    Lindely wrote: »
    I agree with you that most activities in this game have no relation to one another, and some are way less rewarding than the others. I also think that making the upgrading system a bit more complex and reliant on more aspects of the game than just disenchanting is a good idea, but I feel like the changes you suggested in that regard will over-complicate the system for no good reason. Currently, the crafting professions already have a reasoning to be leveled, but depending on the patch we actually get, some might be more useful than others. Upgrading system can use some additional materials, obtained elsewhere, besides just disenchanting, and that would give players the reason to participate in those activities. But in my opinion it's really important to not overdo it and not over-complicate the system while trying to improve it.

    It's something I didn't really touch on, but the system itself isn't really all the complicated. You have basically one type of upgrade material to care about, specific to your class, the rest of them you can either sell or use for alts or give to friends, etc. Onyx Crystals and Chaos Onyx Crystals were some of the most traded commodities in the game and I feel like broadening the market on those materials will give people more reasons to spend their mesos in trading. Or trade their merits for mesos. It's as much a method for stimulating the economy as it is broadening the range of rewards so that more activities can become relevant to play. I don't necessarily agree that the crafting professions have a reason to be leveled, either, but I haven't played CMS or KMS so I don't know if they made any changes. I definitely didn't see anything there I would be willing to level them for during CBT. That's where my opinions are coming from.

    The tiered upgrades also mean that, as a whole, the difficulty of upgrading increases as you get further along in the progression, naturally by rarity of materials. This is meant to boost up that floor level PvE progression, by making the lowest level of Raids a bit more palatable. That basic experience of jumping into a PUG for a raid will be improved since people won't be going in with complete unupgraded gear due to the relative of ease of getting +3 or even +6 gear. It wouldn't feel like a total uphill battle like pugging does right now. It'd still be difficult, obviously, but with better gear at that base level of raiding, it'll improve the experience a lot more. For high level raids nothing really changes. Just makes things a little more welcoming in that regard.

    DanDK
  • tachiorztachiorz
    Maplestory 2 Rep: 955
    Posts: 19
    Member
    End-game is a terrible idea. Endless progression for the win.
    DanDKbolder_taste